Avert your eyes, Son

60 posts / 0 new
Last post
Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780
Avert your eyes, Son

Guest contributor Lisa Jacobson from Club31Women

Avert your eyes, Son.

His dad started saying it to him from the youngest age - when he was only a little boy. Might have been an alluring commercial while watching the ballgame. Or a billboard while driving down the highway. A pop-up on the computer screen.

As parents, we had purposed to teach him purity from the beginning.

And you wouldn't think that would be too tough to do where we live. We're out in the country, somewhere on the outskirts of a small western town. But that hardly matters anymore.

Temptation can be found anywhere.

Even in Target.

Target? Yeah, I know. That's what I thought too. Until one day we popped in to pick up some flip-flops for the summer and I remarked how he kept bumping into things.

What is your problem, Son??

"I'm just looking down, Mom," And with a nod, he indicated the ads placed strategically above us. Billboards for the lingerie department. Yikes. I'd not seen them.

But then again...I'm not a vulnerable young man either.

Sorry, Son.

I'm sorry the Enemy tries to pull you down everywhere you turn. I feel badly we live in a world that's so ready to compromise a man's commitment to clean living. It's never been easy - only it's far worse now.

Is there nowhere a young man can safely go?

Maybe a Christian family camp. You'd think.

It was a hot July day and we all packed up and headed out for fun and fellowship with a bunch of other believers. Picnic blankets, cold watermelon, and squirt guns. It was promising to be a great day.

So I was surprised to see our oldest son hanging back from the festivities. He's an outgoing guy and usually one of the first out there mixing it up. Except not this time. He stayed close to our small spot and played with his little brothers instead.

What is your problem, Son??

He hesitated for a moment. Then answered, "Mom, I don't know what to do. Dad's taught me to 'avert my eyes', but there doesn't seem anywhere I can turn here."

I glanced around and then saw what he meant.

Most of the ladies there were dressed for a hot summer day. Many with bare skin exposed. Lots of bareness. Yikes, again. Who would have thought he'd have to wrestle with it here?

I noticed a pretty girl nearby and wondered if she realized how difficult she was making it for a guy. Surely, she would have made another choice if she had. She might have thrown a light blouse on over her tank top. Slipped on a longer, breezy skirt. Picked out some walking shorts or a shirt with a higher neckline. She might have covered herself up.

If she only understood how hard he's trying to do the right thing. She might have dressed differently. For his sake. For the sake of all the men out there who want to walk in purity.

If she only knew that the way she dressed up meant a good man needed to look down. He had to turn away from her beauty. That he was missing out on her loveliness because she was showing him more than he was meant to see.

Because we can teach our sons to avert their eyes. To lower their gaze. But what can we do as Christian women? We can't leave our guys stuck in a place where there's nowhere left to turn.

Let's choose modesty - modesty that allows a woman's true beauty to shine through.

In like matter also, that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with propriety and moderation (I Tim. 2:9a).

In His grace,

From here If She Only Knew - Thoughts on Modesty and Beauty | Time-Warp Wife - Empowering Wives to Joyfully Serve

The comment section is fascinating.

What do you think? Is this a lovely piece on teaching women the value of modest dress? (in the comment section the author says that the girl in question was wearing shorts and a tank top at the summer picnic). Is it a great commentary on how to raise young men of virtue who respect and honor women? Or is one short step from "she deserved to be raped because of what she was wearing"?.

Go.

Alissa_Sal's picture
Joined: 06/29/06
Posts: 6427

Bleh. I was kind of laughing at the idea of that poor kid stumbling around because he can't look where he is going because of his parents' psycho rules (okay, it doesn't sound so funny now that I put it that way.) But then I got to the part you bolded and my stomach kind of turned. I'm sure the whole family would be much more comfortable if that pesky girl would just go ahead and put on a burka, huh?

Spacers's picture
Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 4100

We should be teaching all of our children to dress appropriately, we should be teaching all of our children that we don't stare at strangers no matter what or how little they are wearing, and we should be teaching our children that human bodies are beautiful & wonderful but sometimes it's more fun to wonder what's inside the package than to be shown, kwim? I feel sorry for her kids. And I wonder how her boys were dressed? Where they wearing shorts and tank tops? If so, then she's a freaking hypocrite.

Joined: 08/17/04
Posts: 2226

I am all for dressing appropriately for both sexes. I think this is over the top.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

I don't understand this:

If she only understood how hard he's trying to do the right thing. She might have dressed differently. For his sake. For the sake of all the men out there who want to walk in purity.

If she only knew that the way she dressed up meant a good man needed to look down. He had to turn away from her beauty. That he was missing out on her loveliness because she was showing him more than he was meant to see.

What is "the right thing"? Not having thoughts? If you don't want to have them AT ALL and the sight of a shoulder or a knee will trigger them, then you have to go live with monks.

Would it not be better to learn how to handle the thoughts when they come?

mom3girls's picture
Joined: 01/09/07
Posts: 1535

I have read a couple of articles similar to this recently, most I have liked. This one made me want to cuss at the screen a little. I encourage my children to dress modestly, and we do have more strict rules for our kids then some. But never will I tell them that they should dress that way so boys dont have to look at the ground. RIDICULOUS.

Nor will I tell my boy to avert his eyes to the ground. We will teach him to look in a girls eyes, and that if she is wearing clothing that is inappropriate that it might be hard for him to look in her eyes, but will be worth it.

SID081108's picture
Joined: 06/03/09
Posts: 1348

"Spacers" wrote:

We should be teaching all of our children to dress appropriately, we should be teaching all of our children that we don't stare at strangers no matter what or how little they are wearing, and we should be teaching our children that human bodies are beautiful & wonderful but sometimes it's more fun to wonder what's inside the package than to be shown, kwim?

This.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Spacers" wrote:

We should be teaching all of our children to dress appropriately, we should be teaching all of our children that we don't stare at strangers no matter what or how little they are wearing, and we should be teaching our children that human bodies are beautiful & wonderful but sometimes it's more fun to wonder what's inside the package than to be shown, kwim? I feel sorry for her kids. And I wonder how her boys were dressed? Where they wearing shorts and tank tops? If so, then she's a freaking hypocrite.

But isn't "appropriately" wildly subjective and very culturally based? I mean, if my family was based in Spain right now we would be on topless beaches this summer and it would be quite normal.

This came up this past week. Most mornings my sister, SIL and I would work out and then enjoy 1 hour of kid free time at the adult pool. As we were laying there in our bikinis with my Dad (in his swim trunks, no shirt) and tons of other people in bikinis and shorts, a Muslim woman came out in headgear and full pants/shirt. After she left we all wondered "why is she even here?" I mean.......why be on such a trip, where the entirety of it revolves around pool and snorkeling and scuba and dolphin encounters and being in the ocean and whatnot? Why be somewhere where you are CONSTANTLY seeing women dressed in bikinis and topless men? Frankly I thought it was really weird.

My version of appropriate means dressing appropriately to my activity, which means if I am in a pool that I am in a bathing suit. To me it is INappropriate to swim in clothing, unless one has a proclivity for drowning. I found this article disturbing and one step away from the sort of attitude which leads to victim blaming in rape cases.

Spacers's picture
Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 4100

"mom3girls" wrote:

We will teach him to look in a girls eyes, and that if she is wearing clothing that is inappropriate that it might be hard for him to look in her eyes, but will be worth it.

I like this, and I think it's worth saying to the girls, too. Tiven has asked why girls not much older than her have their T&A hanging out all over, and she's told me I should say something. I've told her that when girls dress like that, it's for attention, and the best thing to do is to not give them the attention they crave.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Spacers" wrote:

I like this, and I think it's worth saying to the girls, too. Tiven has asked why girls not much older than her have their T&A hanging out all over, and she's told me I should say something. I've told her that when girls dress like that, it's for attention, and the best thing to do is to not give them the attention they crave.

And if you see Moms huddled under giant mumu's do you tell her that they are wildly insecure and self loathing and to not pity them? I mean jeez...........I find that pretty judgmental of you. I think that I pretty much tell my kids and try to tell myself not to judge people's psyche by what they are wearing. At the end of the day maybe their parents couldn't afford to buy them a new suit this year and they had to wear last years. Maybe they don't have parents who provide them any help or guidance. Maybe they only have hand me downs and are forced to wear what they are wearing. Who knows? I think that its a little rude of you to make that judgement of them and share that judgment with your daughter.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

Yeah...I'm with Melissa all the way.

For many, "clean living" doesn't preclude shorts, bathing suits, and tank tops.

Everyone has a different standard, and this to me is really the same as burka thinking. Cover up the women so the men don't have to deal with what comes their way when they look. It really puts the blame on the women for any action the men take, and removes the responsibility from the men for their own conduct.

mom3girls's picture
Joined: 01/09/07
Posts: 1535

"freddieflounder101" wrote:

Yeah...I'm with Melissa all the way.

For many, "clean living" doesn't preclude shorts, bathing suits, and tank tops.

Everyone has a different standard, and this to me is really the same as burka thinking. Cover up the women so the men don't have to deal with what comes their way when they look. It really puts the blame on the women for any action the men take, and removes the responsibility from the men for their own conduct.

This is what I thought when I was reading this article. I felt as though the author was blaming girls for her sons inability to control himself. And part of the inability to control themselves comes from not being given the tools as a young child.

Alissa_Sal's picture
Joined: 06/29/06
Posts: 6427

I think we should teach our kids to dress appropriately for the occassion (i.e. I wear nice clothes to work and to more formal occassions, shorts and flip flops to casual things, et cetera) but also to not judge people by their outer appearance. So what if someone's shorts are "too short" (as I define it - my idea of too short and someone else's may not be the same.) As Melissa said, we don't know their circumstances, and even if we did, it's just (part of) a human body we're seeing. It's not a BFD. That girl has thighs and a butt? So do I. So do my kids. It's not a huge thing unless we make it a huge thing.

mom3girls's picture
Joined: 01/09/07
Posts: 1535

"Alissa_Sal" wrote:

I think we should teach our kids to dress appropriately for the occassion (i.e. I wear nice clothes to work and to more formal occassions, shorts and flip flops to casual things, et cetera) but also to not judge people by their outer appearance. So what if someone's shorts are "too short" (as I define it - my idea of too short and someone else's may not be the same.) As Melissa said, we don't know their circumstances, and even if we did, it's just (part of) a human body we're seeing. It's not a BFD. That girl has thighs and a butt? So do I. So do my kids. It's not a huge thing unless we make it a huge thing.

I agree with most of this, but I do have to say that the shorts that are in all the teen stores are so short. My oldest DD asked the other day if the people that design them like "vaginas hanging out all over the place"

Alissa_Sal's picture
Joined: 06/29/06
Posts: 6427

I don't think I've ever seen an actual vagina hanging out of a pair of shorts. Vaginas don't really hang. One hopes. Biggrin

Joined: 05/13/02
Posts: 414

I think it's a little crappy to say the only reason a girl is wearing short shorts or a tank top is for attention. Honestly, when it's really hot I would totally wish I could dress like that if I weighed less.

Should we all go back to wearing the swimsuits they wore in the 1920s?

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

Yeah, girls just must dress better here. Or have less hangy vaginas. Now if very old men were wearing very short shorts I could envision a not so pleasant on the eye situation....... Smile

Joined: 05/13/02
Posts: 414

Oh man, some of the male runners I've seen at summer races should definitely NOT wear super short-shorts...

Alissa_Sal's picture
Joined: 06/29/06
Posts: 6427

:spit2::ROFL:

Less. Hangy. Vaginas.

mom3girls's picture
Joined: 01/09/07
Posts: 1535

Dh and I were wondering what vaginas she was thinking about!

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

Not sure what is so offensive about her article. I think modesty is wonderful. And each society is different I totally agree.. what is modest here would not be the same in rural africa, nor the middle east. I think chastity and modesty are among some of the more laudable traits.

Spacers's picture
Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 4100

I'm not talking shorts and tank tops, and I'm not talking about kids who outgrew their bathing suits. I'm talking about clothing that is intentionally skimpy. Shorts so short on all sides that butt cheeks and Brazilian wax jobs (or the lack of....) were clearly visible. :shock: On both sexes. Boobs in push-up bras with tops cropped so high and unbuttoned so low that their bras were visible at both ends. On girls who told Tiven they were 12. Walking around at the fair. I don't accept any reason to wear stuff like that *except* attention. A bikini at the beach would have covered the same amount of skin, and that would have been an appropriate place to dress that way. I have nothing against the human body, I've shared labor pics where my boobs are floating freely in the birth pool, because labor is a very appropriate time to be unclothed. I've sunbathed nude, in places where it was allowed and, therefore, appropriate, but you won't find me joining The Naked Guys in the Castro plaza. I've played strip poker with good friends in the privacy of one of our homes. But in general and in public, I think private parts need to stay private on both sexes. Actually, I'd rather see someone in public buck naked than so skimpily dressed that nothing is left to the imagination. Go all the way, or go home & put on some real clothes. Blum 3

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

Really? See, I'd put generosity or compassion or work ethic or like a hundred things above the mere ability to wear a baggy dress.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

Not sure what is so offensive about her article. I think modesty is wonderful. And each society is different I totally agree.. what is modest here would not be the same in rural africa, nor the middle east. I think chastity and modesty are among some of the more laudable traits.

Modesty is lovely. I think modesty is admirable and nice. But I don't think it's fair to think that girls shouldn't wear shorts & tank tops because of the effect on boys and how it makes them make wrong choices. It takes all the responsibility off of the boys.

I also think you can be modest and still wear shorts or a nice light summer dress, or any variety of things.

I also think you can be covered up and look obscene. The tight pants I see on some people....oh MY.

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

Really? See, I'd put generosity or compassion or work ethic or like a hundred things above the mere ability to wear a baggy dress.

Was I rating them above generosity? or compassion or work ethic? I am saying they are not negative traits.

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"freddieflounder101" wrote:

Modesty is lovely. I think modesty is admirable and nice. But I don't think it's fair to think that girls shouldn't wear shorts & tank tops because of the effect on boys and how it makes them make wrong choices. It takes all the responsibility off of the boys.

I also think you can be modest and still wear shorts or a nice light summer dress, or any variety of things.

I also think you can be covered up and look obscene. The tight pants I see on some people....oh MY.

1- Life isn't fair.
2- For those in more conservative Christian mindset, we are not to cause our brother to stumble.. whether that is handing an alcoholic a drink or flaunting sexuality in front of someone... etc.
3- Everyone is responsible for themselves.. but to allow someone to push something onto you that you struggle with, and say just don't do it or don't think about it isn't right either.. we need to have compassion for each other....
Is it only the druggies fault they are addicted to drugs? Or should those family members and friends offering them drugs stop? Everyone is responsible for their own actions but we shouldn't make it harder on each other either.
4- I do agree you can be "covered up" and immodest.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

Was I rating them above generosity? or compassion or work ethic? I am saying they are not negative traits.

Well, you actually said they were "some of the more laudable traits". Meaning more laudable than others. And I put baggy dresses really low on my list of truly laudable traits- that mindset is hard for me to relate to. I also know and expect men who are honorable and raised to have self control and immense respect and regard for women so we don't have to hide ourselves away to prevent them from their sinful uncontrollable selves.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

2- For those in more conservative Christian mindset, we are not to cause our brother to stumble.. whether that is handing an alcoholic a drink or flaunting sexuality in front of someone... etc.
3- Everyone is responsible for themselves.. but to allow someone to push something onto you that you struggle with, and say just don't do it or don't think about it isn't right either.. we need to have compassion for each other....

But if I wear summer clothes I'm not pushing anything onto anyone. Same for a teenage girl in shorts.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

My body is not a drug and men are not all addicts. That's a downright creepy analogy.

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

Well, you actually said they were "some of the more laudable traits". Meaning more laudable than others. And I put baggy dresses really low on my list of truly laudable traits- that mindset is hard for me to relate to. I also know and expect men who are honorable and raised to have self control and immense respect and regard for women so we don't have to hide ourselves away to prevent them from their sinful uncontrollable selves.

They aren't an unlaudable trait are they Potter?... seriously!
And don't you think this boys parents especially his father was trying to teach him self control and respect and regard for women?

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

My body is not a drug and men are not all addicts. That's a downright creepy analogy.

I think it is a perfect analogy.. and who said ALL men are addicts?

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"freddieflounder101" wrote:

But if I wear summer clothes I'm not pushing anything onto anyone. Same for a teenage girl in shorts.

We are speaking modest vs immodesty.. IF you are dressing immodestly it does PUSh your sexuality onto people. Whether they have a problem internally or not varies.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

We are speaking modest vs immodesty.. IF you are dressing immodestly it does PUSh your sexuality onto people. Whether they have a problem internally or not varies.

Depends on what you mean by immodestly.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

They aren't an unlaudable trait are they Potter?... seriously!
And don't you think this boys parents especially his father was trying to teach him self control and respect and regard for women?

How? By avoiding women and averting his eyes?

AlyssaEimers's picture
Joined: 08/22/06
Posts: 6560

I think this is an area where balance is key. Every individual is going to have a different opinion on what is modest. Boys do need to learn to live in and deal with their environment. I love the idea of teaching them not to stare at all and to look into peoples eyes. That said, woman/girls do not need to dress like they are working the street either.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

I think it is a perfect analogy

So....if someone is an alcoholic, is it okay for total strangers to have a cocktail or a beer outside at a sidewalk cafe? I mean, the person could SEE that people are drinking and enjoying themselves.

I'm not talking about being their friend and inviting them over and shoving a drink into their hands, I'm thinking of this the same way as a total stranger walking around in a summer outfit that shows her legs, her arms, her neck, a bit of cleavage, etc.

(Drug use is different as it's illegal and so is rarely done out in the open, except at concerts & such.)

Alissa_Sal's picture
Joined: 06/29/06
Posts: 6427

"Potter75" wrote:

Well, you actually said they were "some of the more laudable traits". Meaning more laudable than others. And I put baggy dresses really low on my list of truly laudable traits- that mindset is hard for me to relate to. I also know and expect men who are honorable and raised to have self control and immense respect and regard for women so we don't have to hide ourselves away to prevent them from their sinful uncontrollable selves.

And this is the crux of it for me. Most of the men I know (and all of the men I associate with) are good and decent men who have no trouble controlling themselves even around a pretty lady in a bikini or whatever. I know it can be done, and I actually *don't* believe that we are doing our men and boys any favors by teaching them that the sight of a woman's skin is so tantilizing and tempting that the only way to deal with it is to actively look away and avoid it, lest they lose control of themselves. Yikes! It reminds me of how the Victorians were so enamored with women's ankles that they had to cover up table legs. But after prolonged exposure to table legs (not to mention real lady ankles) the vast majority of men are able to look at an uncovered table without falling into a frenzy of lust. I bet two things. 1) I bet those boys and men still occassionally lust after girls and women no matter how modestly they are dressed, because that is how we're built, and I don't think that a turtle kneck sweater is really going to change that. I can tell you for a fact that I lust after my husband fully clothed all of the time, and I hope he's doing the same for me. 2) I bet that if those men and boys saw lady knees and collarbones all of the time, they would become common place and wouldn't incite any particular lust. I'm not saying they wouldn't lust - they still would just like I'm sure they still do. It just wouldn't be super tantilizing to catch sight of a knee or a flash of tummy, because it would be normal.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

They aren't an unlaudable trait are they Potter?... seriously!
And don't you think this boys parents especially his father was trying to teach him self control and respect and regard for women?

NO, I absolutely don't think that they were trying to teach him respect for women by teaching him that he could not even look at women in natural, normal, heat appropriate clothing. I think that they were teaching him that those women were acting in shameful or sinful ways, which is untrue. To act as though these young girls were being temptresses is wrong and NOT respectful. And yes, I think that it is unlaudable to teach our girls that they are committing sins by dressing in tank tops and shorts.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

We are speaking modest vs immodesty.. IF you are dressing immodestly it does PUSh your sexuality onto people. Whether they have a problem internally or not varies.

Do you honestly believe that me wearing a bikini at the beach is pushing my sexuality onto people in the same way that pushing a drink into an alcoholics hand is? That is just scary thinking. I assure you that I wear a bikini because I find it comfortable swimming wear. My husband (and the men in my family and my friends husbands) are able to see me in it without turning into lustful raping beasts, because they grew up in a culture and in families where women wearing bikinis were normal, and they were taught to respect women~ that womens bodies were their own, and that men were in charge of minding and controlling their own lustful desires. It is NOT my job to protect men from themselves.

ClairesMommy's picture
Joined: 08/15/06
Posts: 2299

I think it's icky. To me it's very original sin-ish, the female corrupts the male by tempting him with 'forbidden fruit' type thing. It's gross. Puts the onus on the female to curb a man's impure thoughts and that's just so....I can't even find the words.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

Right...next step = burkas for all of us.

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

NO, I absolutely don't think that they were trying to teach him respect for women by teaching him that he could not even look at women in natural, normal, heat appropriate clothing. I think that they were teaching him that those women were acting in shameful or sinful ways, which is untrue. To act as though these young girls were being temptresses is wrong and NOT respectful. And yes, I think that it is unlaudable to teach our girls that they are committing sins by dressing in tank tops and shorts.

Who said that it was a sin to wear a tank top and shorts?

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

Do you honestly believe that me wearing a bikini at the beach is pushing my sexuality onto people in the same way that pushing a drink into an alcoholics hand is? That is just scary thinking. I assure you that I wear a bikini because I find it comfortable swimming wear. My husband (and the men in my family and my friends husbands) are able to see me in it without turning into lustful raping beasts, because they grew up in a culture and in families where women wearing bikinis were normal, and they were taught to respect women~ that womens bodies were their own, and that men were in charge of minding and controlling their own lustful desires. It is NOT my job to protect men from themselves.

Do you think lust (a sin of thought) is wrong?
Do you know what everyone is thinking all the time?

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

Who said that it was a sin to wear a tank top and shorts?

The girl in question was forcing this boy to look at the ground due to her tank top and shorts. His mother wanted her to dress differently so that he could view her true beauty (?!?!?!?!!?). He could not look upon her due to her (normal) clothing choice. The implication is obvious. Her clothing was so sinful as to be unviewable.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

Do you think lust (a sin of thought) is wrong?
Do you know what everyone is thinking all the time?

I've been told I have a pretty face. To look upon my face *could* cause men to lust. My daughter has this problem as well, beautiful blue eyes and blond hair. Ought we cover our faces lest men may lust?

I enjoy running. Could the sight of my body running make men lust? After all, my breasts bounce around some and perhaps the sight of me sweating makes men think of the act of sexual congress and bedding me with wild abandon. Ought I never run? Or only run in special women only gyms?

What on earth SHOULD I wear to swim in? I have a nice figure, it *MAY* incite lust in any man or woman, I DON'T know anyones thoughts! Should I never leave the home? My children would have horrible lives!

Your thought process is terrifying.

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

I've been told I have a pretty face. To look upon my face *could* cause men to lust. My daughter has this problem as well, beautiful blue eyes and blond hair. Ought we cover our faces lest men may lust?

I enjoy running. Could the sight of my body running make men lust? After all, my breasts bounce around some and perhaps the sight of me sweating makes men think of the act of sexual congress and bedding me with wild abandon. Ought I never run? Or only run in special women only gyms?

What on earth SHOULD I wear to swim in? I have a nice figure, it *MAY* incite lust in any man or woman, I DON'T know anyones thoughts! Should I never leave the home? My children would have horrible lives!

Your thought process is terrifying.

You didn't answer my question.. you have no idea of my thought process because you are too busy assuming.

You said that the men in your family/friends circle do not look at you in a lustful way.. you obviously lied.. because just now you said you do not know their thoughts... again.. would it be wrong for them to have lust in their hearts?

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

"Rivergallery" wrote:

You didn't answer my question.. you have no idea of my thought process because you are too busy assuming.

You said that the men in your family/friends circle do not look at you in a lustful way.. you obviously lied.. because just now you said you do not know their thoughts... again.. would it be wrong for them to have lust in their hearts?

Don't call me a liar Rachel. I said quite clearly that they are able to view me "WITHOUT TURNING INTO LUSTFUL RAPING BEASTS". That is true. At the end of my post I acknowledge QUITE clearly that men are in charge of minding and controlling lust if they have it- that is NOT my job. I've answered your question in spades.

And now you are not answering MY questions. Anything can cause a man to lust. A pretty face. An ankle. A running woman. What should we do? Never leave the house...................OR do we take my tactic and make men responsible for their own emotions and sins?

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

You said two different things.. in direct contrast.. opposite of each other.. I do not see a way to rectify it.. and you have yet to explain it.. I am refusing to play your GAME Potter.. you don't want to have an interaction.

Joined: 05/31/06
Posts: 4780

Aka- you admit defeat. And my name isn't Potter, Rachel, it's Melissa. Stop being rude just because you lose a debate.

Joined: 03/08/03
Posts: 3187

"Rivergallery" wrote:

You said two different things.. in direct contrast.. opposite of each other.. I do not see a way to rectify it.. and you have yet to explain it.. I am refusing to play your GAME Potter.. you don't want to have an interaction.

Actually she said that she knows men could have lustful thoughts just from watching her jog, or seeing her pretty daughter.

So is the answer that all women should cover up to save the men? And to blame the women for tempting them if they don't?

Rivergallery's picture
Joined: 05/23/03
Posts: 1301

"Potter75" wrote:

Aka- you admit defeat. And my name isn't Potter, Rachel, it's Melissa. Stop being rude just because you lose a debate.

Calling you by your ID isn't rude.

Pages