Boy Scouts Tp (Possibly) End Homosexual Ban - Page 44
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  1. #431
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddieflounder101 View Post
    Wait.
    1. How is this taking the government out of it?
    2. How is it NOT threatening to you to have marriage involve friends, siblings, whatever, but it IS threatening to you to have gay couples marry?

    How the heck is this BETTER? What problem does this solve, exactly?
    Because it takes marriage out of the government. It makes it exactly what it should be a legal partnership that is available to anyone. It solves all the problems because there would be no rules about who is able to have a legal partnership. No discrimination against people who don't want to get married but still want the same legal rights as anyone else to be able to have a designated person on their insurance on whatever else. No discrimination against people who want a partnership with more than one person. No discrimination against two best friends who are not gay who live together and want to buy a house together and have estate rights. They sign a legal partnership license with that person and it is valid as long as they want it to be. Then the government isn't definining what a "marriage" is.

    Marriage is a seperate thing then up to each individual or group to decide what it means to them. If gays want to get married... go for it ... I don't have to recognize it as a marriage because that isn't what a marriage is to me. If the Catholic church wants to regulate marriage and divorce within their church just as they do now let them, no problem. Then everyone is happy.
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  2. #432
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Marriage is a seperate thing then up to each individual or group to decide what it means to them. If gays want to get married... go for it ... I don't have to recognize it as a marriage because that isn't what a marriage is to me. If the Catholic church wants to regulate marriage and divorce within their church just as they do now let them, no problem. Then everyone is happy.
    Why have you been so tolerant of the government using the word up until the gay marriage debate.

    Because surely up until now there have been other things about governments 'legal partnership called marriage' that differ from your brand of christianity's marriage. There is all sorts of legal jargon that doesn't exist in your bible that exist in the government version and surely things that do exist in your religion that don't in a 'legal partnership called marriage'. Like in my religion, i must be married by a Catholic priest or else its not a marriage. Yet legally that requirement doesn't exist. Homosexuality though...for some odd reason is a show stopper. That coupled with the initial "gay families hurt society" but then later seemingly accepting these famlies as long as they don't use your 8 letter word...this whole thing seems very disingenuous and feels like a direct affront against homosexuals specifically and a desparate attempt to find any which argument to prevent them from getting together legally, at this moment in hisotry.

    The fact that the legal version was never like a religious marriage has never bothered anyone up until this point. IMO that says this is all about fear.
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  3. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Because it takes marriage out of the government. It makes it exactly what it should be a legal partnership that is available to anyone. It solves all the problems because there would be no rules about who is able to have a legal partnership. No discrimination against people who don't want to get married but still want the same legal rights as anyone else to be able to have a designated person on their insurance on whatever else. No discrimination against people who want a partnership with more than one person. No discrimination against two best friends who are not gay who live together and want to buy a house together and have estate rights. They sign a legal partnership license with that person and it is valid as long as they want it to be. Then the government isn't definining what a "marriage" is.

    Marriage is a seperate thing then up to each individual or group to decide what it means to them. If gays want to get married... go for it ... I don't have to recognize it as a marriage because that isn't what a marriage is to me. If the Catholic church wants to regulate marriage and divorce within their church just as they do now let them, no problem. Then everyone is happy.
    What? The problem that needs to be solved is that gay people want to get married.

    Any two people can live together and buy a house together and have estate rights. Already.

    Any people can form a business partnership.

    None of those are problems that need to be solved. All of those issues are already solved. The only thing you can't do is add random people to your health insurance who aren't family members. I assume that is to protect companies from outrageous costs as people add their friends to their work-provided insurance. That doesn't seem unreasonable to me.

    The issue that needs solving is that gay couples want to get married. The other issue that you keep ignoring, but used to care about, is the family unit and how marriage benefits society.

    I don't want a legal partnership with my husband, I want to be his wife. And guess what? LOTS and LOTS of people feel this way about their relationships as well. That's why marriage is so popular! That might even be why YOU got married, who knows?

    If we took marriage away from the church, would that be a good solution for you? It actually solves ALL the problems.
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  4. #434
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddieflounder101 View Post
    If we took marriage away from the church, would that be a good solution for you? It actually solves ALL the problems.
    Actually it wouldn't because that would be unconstitutional. You can't tell a church what they can/cannot do.
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  5. #435
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Actually it wouldn't because that would be unconstitutional. You can't tell a church what they can/cannot do.
    You can just make it so church marriage doesn't count legally, and religious figures don't have the power to LEGALLY marry people, they can only do it so that marriage is recognized within the church. There! All the problems are solved now.
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  6. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Because it takes marriage out of the government. It makes it exactly what it should be a legal partnership that is available to anyone. It solves all the problems because there would be no rules about who is able to have a legal partnership. No discrimination against people who don't want to get married but still want the same legal rights as anyone else to be able to have a designated person on their insurance on whatever else. No discrimination against people who want a partnership with more than one person. No discrimination against two best friends who are not gay who live together and want to buy a house together and have estate rights. They sign a legal partnership license with that person and it is valid as long as they want it to be. Then the government isn't definining what a "marriage" is.

    Marriage is a seperate thing then up to each individual or group to decide what it means to them. If gays want to get married... go for it ... I don't have to recognize it as a marriage because that isn't what a marriage is to me. If the Catholic church wants to regulate marriage and divorce within their church just as they do now let them, no problem. Then everyone is happy.

    This is just so weird. People can already DO this stuff, Gloria. My BIL bought a condo with his friend before they were married. It had nothing to do with MARRIAGE or discrimination ~ they simply wanted to make an investment in their early 20's. It isn't called a legal partnership, its called a mortgage, silly. Are you really that in the dark about this stuff? Its downright wild!

    Second bolded, no one cares what you think about their marriage. I know some people who view your current marriage as adultery. I'm sure you don't care. All that matters is what YOU think, gay people feel the same way. They just want to be legally married, and have the joy of legal recognition, and to be able to have a beautiful, legal ceremony in front of their loved ones, and to build a family, adopt or conceive children and raise them with the blessing of the community. They don't give a crap what bigots think about them.

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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    This is just so weird. People can already DO this stuff, Gloria. My BIL bought a condo with his friend before they were married. It had nothing to do with MARRIAGE or discrimination ~ they simply wanted to make an investment in their early 20's. It isn't called a legal partnership, its called a mortgage, silly. Are you really that in the dark about this stuff? Its downright wild!

    Second bolded, no one cares what you think about their marriage. I know some people who view your current marriage as adultery. I'm sure you don't care. All that matters is what YOU think, gay people feel the same way. They just want to be legally married, and have the joy of legal recognition, and to be able to have a beautiful, legal ceremony in front of their loved ones, and to build a family, adopt or conceive children and raise them with the blessing of the community. They don't give a crap what bigots think about them.
    I know people can already do all that stuff. The argument from Gays FOR YEARS has been that they shouldn't have to go through extra steps besides a marriage license to be able to do those things, which is what they say it is infringing on their RIGHTS.
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    No, the argument is that they want to get married. They want the right to get married, which is the one right you want them to not have.
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  9. #439
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    Agreed. I'm not arguing mortgage rights for them because they can already purchase property together just as 2 people like anyone else could. I am arguing for their right to be married like I am.

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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddieflounder101 View Post
    You can just make it so church marriage doesn't count legally, and religious figures don't have the power to LEGALLY marry people, they can only do it so that marriage is recognized within the church. There! All the problems are solved now.
    Agreed! Many other countries do it this way already. You get married at the courthouse by a government official, and then those who choose to have a religious marriage do it again at church. Problem solved. No church is forced to marry anyone they don't want to, and everyone who wants the legal protections of marriage get them.
    70% of the U.S. population now lives in a state where same-sex marriage is legal. At 36 and counting!

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