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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    If a teacher can not be fired for lying to her bosses, what then do you feel is a justifiable reason to be fired?
    Who is this directed to?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Who is this directed to?
    Anyone who did not think the school should be able to fire her. What then is a reason a boss could fire someone if not lying?

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    Community Host Sapphire Sunsets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Can you provide a link to an example of the morals clause CA teachers sign? I can't find any information saying you are right about that, so I'd like proof. Also, are the contracts retroactive and do they cover the time before a person became a teacher? She did this porn years ago when she wasn't contractually bound by anything. It appears that she had been honoring this "morality clause" you think she signed as she was not doing porn currently.

    There are over 300,000 public school teachers in CA. Is having an extramarital affair against their "morality clause" because clearly that action would show that they have no morals (in your view, to use your words), I bet we ALL agree on that one. Do all teachers who have (or HAVE had) affairs get automatically fired? What about smokers? To some smoking is immoral. Some people think that women who don't cover their head, or who wear, say, shorts are immoral. I have several friends who used to teach who lived with their fiance before they were married ~ should they have been fired for living with a man out of wedlock? Would the more religious amongst us have the right to petition for the firing of a teacher due to their moral beliefs . How about if you had a DUI 8 years ago? Too immoral? A teacher goes on Vacation in Jamaica and smokes some weed, too immoral to teach?

    I don't really believe that this teacher signed a morality clause. I bet in private schools you see this more, where people all have one idea of what "moral" means...............I just find it really hard to believe that this woman, a public school teacher, signed a clause in her contract that meant she was going to conform to some vague idea of morality, AND that it worked retroactively, covering every decision she had ever made prior to getting hired.

    Morals Clause Law & Legal Definition

    [quote]A morals clause is a provision in a contract or official document that prohibits certain behavior in a person's private life. They deal with behavior such as sexual acts and drug use.[quote]

    Teachers' Rights: State and Local Laws - FindLaw

    CALIFORNIA: Permanent teachers may be dismissed for immoral or unprofessional conduct, dishonesty, incompetence, evident unfitness for service, a physical or mental condition unfitting for a teacher to instruct or associate with children, persistent violation of school laws or regulations, conviction of a felony or crime involving moral turpitude, or alcoholism or drug abuse rendering teacher unfit for service. Teacher's certificate may be revoked or suspended on the same grounds as those for dismissal or suspension.

    Any job you had before you become a teacher is questionable in a morals clause. If she was just doing the porn in her home and it never came out on the net (where students and parents can see it, BTW!) then it would be a non issue.

    If you have to question whether doing something that could be considered immoral would influence getting a teaching job (or any job that has a morals clause) you probably shouldn't do it.

  4. #24
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    oh, and there is more to this! This article is from March. It is the same woman.

    California Teacher Put on Leave For Allegedly Moonlighting as Porn Star - ABC News

    A California science teacher who allegedly moonlighted as a porn star has been put on leave after fellow teachers used their smart phones to find the woman’s film credits.
    The identity of the seventh and eighth grade teacher was not released by the Oxnard School District which is meeting tonight to decide what to do about the teacher’s other career.
    In the meantime, the school district sent a letter home to parents. The letter, obtained by ABC News, advises parents that no students are involved in the scandal, but asks them to strictly monitor students so they do not access these sites that the letter says “contain extremely graphic and inappropriate pornographic material.”
    The letter particularly asks parents to make sure their children do not share links or content on Facebook or other social networking sites.
    Rumors of the teacher’s acting sideline started as gossip among students last Friday, but once these rumors reached administrators, they decided to take action.
    “Some students at Richard B. Haydock Intermediate School started a rumor that one of the teachers at the school was involved in pornography,” Oxnard School District Superintendent Jeff Chancer told ABC News.
    Administrators were unable to find the alleged movies because software within school computers prohibited access to inappropriate sites. After they could not verify the claims, administrators sent a memo assuring the school community this was all just a rumor.
    However, teachers at the school searched sites on their smartphones, which could bypass the school’s protective firewall, and found X-Rated material supposedly featuring their colleague.
    “Administrators looked at the videos and they felt that it may be one of their teachers. So they contacted the district and we investigated it,” Chancer told ABC News.
    “We contacted the teacher over the weekend, met with her on Monday morning, and at 8 a.m. we placed her on administrative leave,” he said.
    The Oxnard School District will meet tonight at a regularly scheduled board meeting and will discuss the future investigation and further action that will be taken.

    Going by this, she was doing it currently.

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    Calif. Teacher With Past in Porn Loses Appeal - ABC News


    A middle school teacher who was fired after students learned she had appeared in pornography has lost her appeal to return to the classroom, her lawyer said Tuesday.A three-judge panel unanimously decided Stacie Halas, 32, was unfit for the classroom. Halas was fired in April from her job as a science teacher at Haydock Intermediate School in Oxnard after online videos of her in porn were discovered by students and teachers.
    "Although (Halas') pornography career has concluded, the ongoing availability of her pornographic materials on the Internet will continue to impede her from being an effective teacher and respected colleague,"
    Judge Julie Cabos-Owen wrote in a 46-page decision issued Friday by the Commission on Professional Competence.
    Halas was continually deceitful about her nine-month career in porn before she went to work at the school, the decision said.
    Her lawyer Richard Schwab said Halas had tried to be honest but was embarrassed by her previous experience in the adult industry.

    "Miss Halas is more than just an individual fighting for her job as a teacher," he said Tuesday. "I think she's representative of a lot of people who may have a past that may not involve anything illegal or anything that hurts anybody."Halas has been on administrative leave since the video surfaced in March.
    Student claims that the teacher was moonlighting as a porn star were initially dismissed after school officials said they couldn't find any images of her on the Internet — but they were using the school's computers, which don't allow access to porn.
    Teachers then showed administrators downloads of Halas' sex videos from their smartphones.
    In hearings, former assistant principal Wayne Saddler testified that at the start of a sex video, Halas talked about being a teacher and he felt her effectiveness in the classroom had been compromised.
    After rumors of her performance surfaced, profanity was etched on Halas' classroom window, a teacher testified.
    Schwab has said Halas did not star in pornographic movies while teaching in any district. He said she took parts only during an eight-month period from 2005 to 2006 because of financial problems after her boyfriend abandoned her.
    District superintendent Jeff Chancer applauded the commission's ruling.
    Halas' decision to "engage in pornography was incompatible with her responsibilities as a role model for students and would present an insurmountable, recurring disruption to our schools should she be allowed to remain as a teacher," Chancer said in a statement.

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    [QUOTE=Sapphire Sunsets;9043302]Morals Clause Law & Legal Definition

    [quote]A morals clause is a provision in a contract or official document that prohibits certain behavior in a person's private life. They deal with behavior such as sexual acts and drug use.

    Teachers' Rights: State and Local Laws - FindLaw




    Any job you had before you become a teacher is questionable in a morals clause. If she was just doing the porn in her home and it never came out on the net (where students and parents can see it, BTW!) then it would be a non issue.

    If you have to question whether doing something that could be considered immoral would influence getting a teaching job (or any job that has a morals clause) you probably shouldn't do it.
    I don't believe that the bolded is true, what are you basing that statement on? And are you saying that doing porn in private is moral, as long as it isn't on the internet? So the internet is what makes it immoral? So being a porn star on stage is fine, just not on the internet?

    You have some interesting ideas of morality! Different than mine, obviously, but we already knew that. I still don't believe that she signed a morals clause to get her job. Even if she did, I don't see that a video she made 8 years ago when she was NOT bound to a contract has any bearing on any contract her teaching position may entail. Were I to submit a resume today to return to my career I would not include some waitressing or bartending jobs I held 18 years ago ~ they have nothing to do with my career in finance and sales. I don't think that it innately dishonest of her to leave off her brief stint in porn, it had nothing to do with her teaching career, and a resume is generally representative of ones experience or qualifications in a given field, not a detailed history of ones life.

  7. #27
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    [QUOTE=Potter75;9043321][QUOTE=Sapphire Sunsets;9043302]Morals Clause Law & Legal Definition

    A morals clause is a provision in a contract or official document that prohibits certain behavior in a person's private life. They deal with behavior such as sexual acts and drug use.

    I don't believe that the bolded is true, what are you basing that statement on? And are you saying that doing porn in private is moral, as long as it isn't on the internet? So the internet is what makes it immoral? So being a porn star on stage is fine, just not on the internet?

    You have some interesting ideas of morality! Different than mine, obviously, but we already knew that. I still don't believe that she signed a morals clause to get her job. Even if she did, I don't see that a video she made 8 years ago when she was NOT bound to a contract has any bearing on any contract her teaching position may entail. Were I to submit a resume today to return to my career I would not include some waitressing or bartending jobs I held 18 years ago ~ they have nothing to do with my career in finance and sales. I don't think that it innately dishonest of her to leave off her brief stint in porn, it had nothing to do with her teaching career, and a resume is generally representative of ones experience or qualifications in a given field, not a detailed history of ones life.

    What I'm saying is that she was getting PAIDED to do it. If you are involved in the adult entertainment industry (or have been in the past) when it comes out in the open it's going to have an impact on your present job. You really think the students (who are the ones who found the videos) are going to take her seriously? Keeping her in that job would have made her life complete hell. They would have been calling her all sorts of names, and i'm sure that some even thought about propostitioning(sp?) her. She wasn't just doing porn with her s/o, she was doing it with random people and it wasn't just one video, there are several. Brief stint? A brief stint would have been a month or two, not 8 or 9 months. Besides the fact, do you want someone who did porn to pay to go to school as a teacher really teaching your kids?

    You have no idea what my ideas of morality are. Can you debate without the jabs? They aren't necessary.

    Have you ever filled out a app to be a teacher? I'm not going to assume they don't have a section where they ask if people had a past in the adult industry.

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    I find this really frustrating. If her students had found out and it was causing a huge disruption, I could see how it is relevent, but even then one would hope that the school tried to work with her to find a solution before they fired her. The fact that her coworkers found out stirred up trouble makes it sound like a bunch of busybodies finding trouble where there didn't need to be any.

    I will have to ask DH if he signed a "morality clause" to work in public school. Even if he did, I can't imagine how things that he did before he was a teacher would be included. If, for example, he was a big drinker in college (he wasn't, but stay with me here) and now he's not, is that a problem for his "morality clause?" I just don't see it.

    Edit: Sorry, just re-read the article and saw that the students were the ones that found it. The first time I got confused by the line "No students were involved in this scandal" thinking that meant that no students had seen the video.

    I still wish they would have tried to find a way to work with her instead of firing her.
    Last edited by Alissa_Sal; 01-17-2013 at 04:36 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Sunsets View Post
    [
    What I'm saying is that she was getting PAIDED to do it. If you are involved in the adult entertainment industry (or have been in the past) when it comes out in the open it's going to have an impact on your present job. You really think the students (who are the ones who found the videos) are going to take her seriously? Keeping her in that job would have made her life complete hell. They would have been calling her all sorts of names, and i'm sure that some even thought about propostitioning(sp?) her. She wasn't just doing porn with her s/o, she was doing it with random people and it wasn't just one video, there are several. Brief stint? A brief stint would have been a month or two, not 8 or 9 months. Besides the fact, do you want someone who did porn to pay to go to school as a teacher really teaching your kids?

    You have no idea what my ideas of morality are. Can you debate without the jabs? They aren't necessary.

    Have you ever filled out a app to be a teacher? I'm not going to assume they don't have a section where they ask if people had a past in the adult industry.
    I know that those living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, I do know that for sure. And I know that no one is perfect. And I think that no one has a perfect past. And I think that this womans past is not illegal. Unsavory, perhaps, but not illegal. No, I haven't filled out an app to be a teacher, but I helped my sister with her resume and helped her prepare for her background check ~ I don't recall any questions asking her (or my BIL) about a history in porn or work as exotic dancers. Thats kind of silly.

    You keep bringing qualifiers on her porn into this ~ wasn't doing it in a basement, wasn't doing it with her SO, wasn't just one video etc. Porn is Porn, no? She was single at the time, its not like she was having affairs on her spouse. She was having the same sex lots of single women have, she was just getting paid for it during a rough patch in her life. Does that really mean she can never have a legitimate job again? Seems like really really harsh justice. I can think of lots of people who have done immoral things, like cheating while married and putting it out there on the internet, who would be terrified at the thought of losing their jobs as a result. A good friend of mine just got busted having an affiar with her best friends husband ~ via the internet. Should she never be able to work again because she did something immoral and totally CRAPPY, but not illegal? It probably wouldn't seem fair to them (nor does it seem fair to me). People make mistakes, especially young people. Taking away their right to a career as a result seems really harsh.

    I would hope that the teachers union would find a way to help her. Maybe a name change and a relocation within the state to a new job at the elementary level or something. It just seems unfair to me that she has to lose a position she is trained for because of something unrelated from her past.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alissa_Sal View Post
    I find this really frustrating. If her students had found out and it was causing a huge disruption, I could see how it is relevent, but even then one would hope that the school tried to work with her to find a solution before they fired her. The fact that her coworkers found out stirred up trouble makes it sound like a bunch of busybodies finding trouble where there didn't need to be any.
    Her students did find out and were causing a disruption. That's how they found out. After the kids where talking about it the teachers looked it up to find what the kids were talking about.
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