DOMA and Prop 8 - Page 44
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Thread: DOMA and Prop 8

  1. #431
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    *yawn*

    Is this theology class or a debate on equal rights?

    If the USA takes old or New Testament bible theory into consideration when making laws something has gone awry. All Americans deserve equal rights. The right to marry is one that should extend to gay people as well as straight because our constitution declares all equal.
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  2. #432
    Posting Addict ClairesMommy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Jesus may quote Genesis, but he IS talking about marriage, that is why he says WIFE
    But that is inferred, Gloria. And again, nobody is saying that marriage between a man and a woman is not talked about in the Bible, but nor is it defined solely as such. Why are you being so resistant to that? Why is it okay to do away with some parts of scripture because they don't hold up anymore, yet take others as your own (the whole hetero man/woman marriage thing), turn them into something different because it coincides better with your morals and claim that 2000 years of historical misrepresentation is going to continue to stand the test of time? It won't. It can't. Maybe not in your microcosm, but you can't deny that in the blink of an eye, historically speaking, the world is changing its views on marriage equality because most open minded people, including Christians, know there is no validity in hiding behind scripture and distorting the true message of it.

  3. #433
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    No, it's not a theology class, Melis, but I cannot stand the bible being used in this way. I am the last one to go around citing bible passages, but if Gloria wants to use the claim that the bible defines marriage in one particular way I will challenge that. It is simply not true.

  4. #434
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    The bible was used in this debate to defend slavery and multiple articles have been posted talking about how using the bible to be bigoted against gay Americans is not biblical. Suffice it to say few agree with the "theologians" who are using the bible to excuse their homophobia while not bothering with way bigger issues- like obesity or divorce- because that would make them distinctly uncomfortable. To that end it just gets ridiculous at some point to try to argue with people who will twist the bible into their own personal hate book, that's all.

  5. #435
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    Yes, that is true, of course. Sometimes I need to say my peace, even if I know it will go nowhere.

  6. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivergallery View Post
    None of this answers the position. Instead you are deflecting into other arguments/discussions. I will answer but please address the comment. I think you know the majority of the Founding Fathers, who created the constitution and those who wrote the Federal Bill of Rights had a strong sense of a Sovereign God. To say they did not use the Bible in creating these documents, "The majority of our laws" is short sighted at best.
    I am disputing your claim that the majority of laws are based on the bible. You don't seem to grasp just how many laws there actually are.

    You can say whatever you want about the FF, but the 1st amendment made it clear that the gov't would not endorse one religion over another. If a law is based solely on the bible and has no other argument, it won't hold up to legal challenge. But if no one challenges those laws, they will continue to be law. In the case of same-sex marriage, the laws are now being challenged.

    Currently one group of people is trying to deny others their civil rights. They are basing it on their interpretation of their bible. However, others' religious viewpoints are not in agreement. So whose "wins"? If we're both Christain but I believe divorce is never warranted under any circumstances and you don't, should I get to control the decisions you are allowed to make? If one Christrain group wants to outlaw certain activities between a loving couple, should other couples just have to go along with that because the religious argument was made?
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  7. #437
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    Right. Based on RG's argument atheists wouldn't be allowed to get married. Good grief, could you imagine? The common-law relationships would just run amok. At least they wouldn't be trampling on the rights of us hetero married folks.

  8. #438
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    We don't even have "common law" marriage in most states (and IMO it shouldn't exist at all)

  9. #439
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClairesMommy View Post
    But that is inferred, Gloria. And again, nobody is saying that marriage between a man and a woman is not talked about in the Bible, but nor is it defined solely as such. Why are you being so resistant to that? Why is it okay to do away with some parts of scripture because they don't hold up anymore, yet take others as your own (the whole hetero man/woman marriage thing), turn them into something different because it coincides better with your morals and claim that 2000 years of historical misrepresentation is going to continue to stand the test of time? It won't. It can't. Maybe not in your microcosm, but you can't deny that in the blink of an eye, historically speaking, the world is changing its views on marriage equality because most open minded people, including Christians, know there is no validity in hiding behind scripture and distorting the true message of it.
    If Jesus tells us what it IS.... why does he have to then list everything it isn't? That just doesn't makes sense. If I say my car is blue, do I then have to say.... its not gray, not green, not black? It is NEVER talked about in any other context than between a husband and wife, male and female, man and woman in every verse discussing marriage in the whole new testament. Do you think there were no gay people back then? I'm pretty sure they existed because it was condemned as a sin. So how is marriage not defined solely as between a man and a woman? The world's views don't change what the Bible says in black and white.
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  10. #440
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    I should have never bothered. Anyone want to discourage me from going and banging my head against the wall?

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