Thread: Is Free Birth Control like 9/11 and Pearl Harbor?

Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers

1.3 million abortions preformed per year in America How many abortions per year in the US
less than 1% of women who have abortions do so, because of rape or incest (AGI) REAL Statistics
6% due to either the health of the mother or baby Abortion Statistics

That still leaves 1,209,000 babies dying every year due to abortions that were not for these reasons. Would you accept 1,209,000 woman killing their toddlers each year because they were inconvenient?


I want to again reiterate that although I think abortion should be illegal, I have nothing but compassion for anyone who has been in this situation. It is not meant to judge, but to fight for the rights for those who are too small to fight for themselves.

She didn't want an abortion due to any other reason than to try to save her own life.

Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers

1.3 million abortions preformed per year in America How many abortions per year in the US
less than 1% of women who have abortions do so, because of rape or incest (AGI) REAL Statistics
6% due to either the health of the mother or baby Abortion Statistics

That still leaves 1,209,000 babies dying every year due to abortions that were not for these reasons. Would you accept 1,209,000 woman killing their toddlers each year because they were inconvenient?


I want to again reiterate that although I think abortion should be illegal, I have nothing but compassion for anyone who has been in this situation. It is not meant to judge, but to fight for the rights for those who are too small to fight for themselves.

It wouldn't have been an abortion anyway; it would have been a miscarriage when the baby died. And since teen pregnancies have a higher miscarriage rate to begin with, she could have been perfectly healthy & still have lost the baby at that gestation for any one of many possible reasons.

And the comparison between a living, eating, breathing, completely separate human being and something the size of an olive that can't survive without a host body is ridiculous. Imagine the state our country would be in with another 1.3 million people every year. You think health care and welfare costs are outrageous now? Imagine another 1.3 million unwanted kids draining our system.

Originally Posted by Spacers

And the comparison between a living, eating, breathing, completely separate human being and something the size of an olive that can't survive without a host body is ridiculous. Imagine the state our country would be in with another 1.3 million people every year. You think health care and welfare costs are outrageous now? Imagine another 1.3 million unwanted kids draining our system.

A new born baby can not survive without the help of their parents or another adult. Neither can a toddler. A human life is a human life regardless if it is born yet or not. My oldest was just recently talking to me about babies. She asked me if my youngest (her sister) knew her when she was born. I said yes she did, she was used to hearing her voice. We also talked about how she used to kick her when she was still in me. She was a real live baby. If you were to visit over at the Parents of Preemies board you would find stories of babies born at all different gestations. There was a baby born not to long ago at 26 weeks. He is growing and thriving and soon to be transferred to a closer hospital. What is the great big difference between 24 weeks and 26 weeks? Who are we to decide if a person is not worth life? How do you know that, that person who was just aborted wouldn't be the one to solve world hunger or cure cancer? We don't just kill newborns because they require work and take up resources.

And who are you to decide that any other woman's reproductive decisions are yours to make? The difference between 24 weeks and 26 weeks is a lot of money, a lot of luck, and in my belief system, whether their life force/soul/energy has entered or not. I truly believe that my son wouldn't have survived being born at 30 weeks because *he* wasn't there yet.

Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers

A new born baby can not survive without the help of their parents or another adult. Neither can a toddler. A human life is a human life regardless if it is born yet or not. My oldest was just recently talking to me about babies. She asked me if my youngest (her sister) knew her when she was born. I said yes she did, she was used to hearing her voice. We also talked about how she used to kick her when she was still in me. She was a real live baby. If you were to visit over at the Parents of Preemies board you would find stories of babies born at all different gestations. There was a baby born not to long ago at 26 weeks. He is growing and thriving and soon to be transferred to a closer hospital. What is the great big difference between 24 weeks and 26 weeks? Who are we to decide if a person is not worth life? How do you know that, that person who was just aborted wouldn't be the one to solve world hunger or cure cancer? We don't just kill newborns because they require work and take up resources.

Bonita, I understand your moral argument, I really do. But, a fetus is not a person in the eyes of the law and therefore is not afforded the same rights as infants or children. That is the black and white of it, legally speaking, and until government changes the definition of a 'person' to include a fetus at conception or a certain gestational age that fetus is considered part of a woman's body, not a separate life.

Originally Posted by Spacers

Many of the largest hospitals in the U.S. are run by the Catholic Church. They employee thousands of doctors, nurses, lawyers, and administrators who are very well paid, and a good portion of them are not Catholic. And even something like 90% of Catholics have used birth control and about 60% of Catholics actually support this legislation, so the fact that their church is still opposing it is ridiculous.

This has absolutely nothing to do with any person's religious beliefs, and it has everything to do with a very large employer refusing to follow the law. That's all it is.

This totally slays me.. maybe we should be a bit thankful to religion, and the Catholics for the hospitals we DO have then. If you don't like it RALLY people, raise funding start new religion free hospitals instead. But goodness... Since it wasn't the non-Christians/Catholics who started the hospital in the first place what say should they have in how it is run now? It is like the old story of The Little Red Hen. Can't we be thankful, and then advocate for change by offering an alternative if enough people dislike it?

Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers

A new born baby can not survive without the help of their parents or another adult. Neither can a toddler. A human life is a human life regardless if it is born yet or not. My oldest was just recently talking to me about babies. She asked me if my youngest (her sister) knew her when she was born. I said yes she did, she was used to hearing her voice. We also talked about how she used to kick her when she was still in me. She was a real live baby. If you were to visit over at the Parents of Preemies board you would find stories of babies born at all different gestations. There was a baby born not to long ago at 26 weeks. He is growing and thriving and soon to be transferred to a closer hospital. What is the great big difference between 24 weeks and 26 weeks? Who are we to decide if a person is not worth life? How do you know that, that person who was just aborted wouldn't be the one to solve world hunger or cure cancer? We don't just kill newborns because they require work and take up resources.

Why refer to a living, breathing person as an "it"?

Stacy - To recap - You think it is abuse to tell your child that they should not be gay, but that it is perfectly fine to kill an unborn baby for any reason. Am I misunderstanding? It is just hard to wrap my mind around.

Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers

Stacy - To recap - You think it is abuse to tell your child that they should not be gay, but that it is perfectly fine to kill an unborn baby for any reason. Am I misunderstanding? It is just hard to wrap my mind around.

I believe that the rights of those who are already living should always trump the rights of those who haven't yet been born, and especially those who have no chance of survival outside the womb. I believe that no one should have any say over a woman's body except herself. I believe bringing a child into the world should be a conscious decision that one makes with love & intent & preparation, not because one has been prevented from doing anything else with an unwanted pregnancy. And I believe children are precious, but they are not our belongings and we have no right to try to change who they are once we decide to bring them into the world. Does that clarify my position for you?

ETA: here's an interesting article you might want to take a look at, for the persective of someone who feels she and her mother both would have been better off if her mother had had access to a safe & legal abortion. I actually feel the same way, and it's why I had an abortion even though I was 33 & happily married, because it would have been a disaster for me emotionally & financially & I didn't want to put my child through the hell I had lived through as a child. And it probably would have been the end of my marriage, too, since my husband was even less ready for parenthood than I was. Every fertilized egg shouldn't have to become a person.
http://www.rolereboot.org/culture-an...had-aborted-me

I understand what you are saying, but not for the life of me do I not understand. The child belongs to you as long as it is in your womb, but the moment is it born it does not? There are any number of choices a parent makes for a child. You teach your child to either be Christian or Atheist or whatever else. It does not mean your child will turn out that way or make those choices later in life, but you still taught them what you believe and what you want them to believe. I am sure you will teach your child to respect nature, because that is important to you. It does not make you a bad parent if you teach your child to believe as you do. Abuse is a very strong word that I feel should be reserved for something very specific.

I believe live begins at conception. While this is not what the law says, I am sure you can agree that there are some things that are law that you disagree with. I believe that a child within the womb deserves the same protections and rights as those who are already born. A baby is just as much a baby even if it needs help staying alive. When my youngest was born, she would not have lived without the help of the NICU. She stayed in the NICU for 2 1/2 weeks. You can not tell me that she was more alive in the NICU than her peers who were not yet born. Both needed help to stay alive.