"Free Kate" - Page 5
+ Reply to Thread
Page 5 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 75
Like Tree43Likes

Thread: "Free Kate"

  1. #41
    Community Host
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    13,720

    Default

    Thinking more about this, why does it matter or not if the parents approved? What if it was the 40 year old man and the 14 year old girl? Would it then be ok if the parents of both parties approved? (I know it used to be this way, and can still be this way in other cultures) Abuse is abuse whether or not the parents approve. I believe going to the police was the appropriate course of action.

    ~Bonita~

  2. #42
    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    My avatar is the tai chi -- a symbol of the eternal cycle of life
    Posts
    16,559

    Default

    I don't think it does matter whether the parents approved or not, and the victim's parents obviously did NOT approve. I don't see where anyone is arguing that point. I really don't think that teenagers fondling one another in a bathroom should be a felony. And I'm not sure I like the idea of prosecuting an 18-year-old who is unemployed, living at home, and attending high school, someone who really does seem to be more a child than an adult, for something that neither set of parents seems to have taken reasonable steps to try to prevent.

    If Kate were developmentally disabled, she *would* still be considered a minor child despite her age, and she would not be prosecuted for this, or at least not a felony. Science tells us that *all* teenagers are developmentally far behind where we used to think they are. We're treating people as adults who are clearly still children from a developmental point of view, and that just doesn't make sense.
    SID081108 likes this.
    The number of U.S. states in which a person can marry the person they love regardless of gender: 30 and counting!

  3. #43
    Mega Poster mom3girls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    3,498

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    I don't think it does matter whether the parents approved or not, and the victim's parents obviously did NOT approve. I don't see where anyone is arguing that point. I really don't think that teenagers fondling one another in a bathroom should be a felony. And I'm not sure I like the idea of prosecuting an 18-year-old who is unemployed, living at home, and attending high school, someone who really does seem to be more a child than an adult, for something that neither set of parents seems to have taken reasonable steps to try to prevent.

    If Kate were developmentally disabled, she *would* still be considered a minor child despite her age, and she would not be prosecuted for this, or at least not a felony. Science tells us that *all* teenagers are developmentally far behind where we used to think they are. We're treating people as adults who are clearly still children from a developmental point of view, and that just doesn't make sense.
    Just trying to get this straight, you think we should treat all 18 year old like they are developmentally delayed?
    Lisa
    Molly, Morgan, Mia and Carson

  4. #44
    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    My avatar is the tai chi -- a symbol of the eternal cycle of life
    Posts
    16,559

    Default

    Kind of! I'm definitely not sure we should be treating all 18-year-olds like they are adults. Teenagers do not have a fully developed brain; brain development was one of the arguments in setting the age of majority at 18 in the first place, that was thought to be the age when most development had been completed. It's not. The current generation's brains are actually developing at a slower rate than people of prior generations, because we have so much going on in our world that teenagers are trying to process and their brain development can't keep up. Also, even just 100 years ago, people at 18 were expected to be pretty much self-sufficient or at least well on their way to it, and we simply don't expect that of 18-year-olds any more. So we're raising a generation that because of technology is actually less mature than prior generations (and yes, they are delayed developmentally not only from where we used to think teenagers should be, but from where the current generation of 40-somethings were when we were teenagers) but we are still holding them to the same accountability that was set 100 years ago when most women were married at that age and most men were expected to be living on their own.
    Last edited by Spacers; 06-03-2013 at 06:57 PM.
    The number of U.S. states in which a person can marry the person they love regardless of gender: 30 and counting!

  5. #45
    Mega Poster mom3girls's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    3,498

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    Kind of! I'm definitely not sure we should be treating all 18-year-olds like they are adults. Teenagers do not have a fully developed brain; brain development was one of the arguments in setting the age of majority at 18 in the first place, that was thought to be the age when most development had been completed. It's not. The current generation's brains are actually developing at a slower rate than people of prior generations, because we have so much going on in our world that teenagers are trying to process and their brain development can't keep up. Also, even just 100 years ago, people at 18 were expected to be pretty much self-sufficient or at least well on their way to it, and we simply don't expect that of 18-year-olds any more. So we're raising a generation that because of technology is actually less mature than prior generations (and yes, they are delayed developmentally not only from where we used to think teenagers should be, but from where the current generation of 40-somethings were when we were teenagers) but we are still holding them to the same accountability that was set 100 years ago when most women were married at that age and most men were expected to be living on their own.
    I dont buy into this notion that we should treat them like children or like people with developmental delays. The more we push back the age of accountability the longer people will delay maturing. I actually think we should be expecting more of kids that age. Just read a book call "Do Hard things" with my 13 year old. It was based on the premise that irresponsibility in adolescence is a social construct and not a physiological stage. Totally agree with it. Historically 12 year olds were captains of ships crossing the Atlantic Ocean, now most 12 year olds are not capable of cleaning their room properly.
    In the case of this situation in this debate, this girl was not doing this because she is developmentally delayed, she just wanted sex and used a 14 year old to get that.
    Lisa
    Molly, Morgan, Mia and Carson

  6. #46
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    20,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    Legally, there is no difference. They are both against the law. There is no gradual slide. I do not believe if this was an 18 year old man sleeping with a 14 year old girl that the opinions would be the same.
    I understand that legally it is this way. I am not saying anything to the contrary.

    Like I already said:

    Can't object to the law and its consequences, but i can personally object to someone's choice to exercise the law.
    My point is that the laws are in place because of your 40 year old taking a 14 year old to his house. And I get that they have to define an age of adulthood and there is kind of no way around that. I don't think the laws were in place to give high school kids having consenting sexual encounters felony records. Not speaking legally..it is NOT the same as the 40 year old having sexual encounters with a 14YO as much as you are trying to make it sound like it should be. So I simply wish that the 14YOs parents had tried to exhaust all other options before going to the law and I do not believe they did.

    What did you think the parents of the 18 year old were supposed to do? At 18, they are not going to be the ones deciding if and who their child sleeps with. There are so many other things that an 18 year old would be held responsible for. I know in the school DH works at there is a huge difference between a 17 year old getting into a fist fight and an 18 year old getting in a fist fight.
    The mother in the video even said "I wish they had come to me first" Every senior in high school is different. i actually listened to my parents a lot at that age, even though i had gained a lot of independance. They could have had some serious discussions about this. you know, not all 18 Year olds have this crazy "Screw my parents and waht they say" attitude. A lot of them actually respect eachother and will listen to what their parents have to say. Maybe this 18 year old needed to hear someone else "Hey, what you are doing is really dangerous and can screw you over for the rest of your life...you have to stop this...these parents are going to have the law on their side and you will be the one who suffers the consequences forever" Because this girl is 18...and 18 year olds can be pretty stupid, and they aren't 40 year olds and sometimes they need someone to knock some sense into them.

    Are you jsut going to stop parenting when your child is 18? If not...why are you going to bother? You are making it sounds like its useless to parent your 18 year old. 18th birthday comes and *poof* parents are compeltely useless.

    LOL i still followed a curfew my senior year of high school.

    IMO, if an 18 year old is old enough to enlist and go to war, they are also old enough to make their own decisions. They are also old enough to be responsible for those decisions.
    Yet they can still claim them on your health insurance...most still live at home their high school year, can be claimed as dependents for tax purposes. Tons still actually do listen to their parents whether you feel like they should or not. If the law says they are adults because they can go to war...then why aren't you advocating booting them out of the house and behaving like full grow 40 year old adults should? You are taking laws that are made to try to prove your point and are choosing to simply ignore that reality shows time and time again 18 year olds can be very immature, irrational and do stupid things and benefit from proper guidance. If you don't believe the last part of what i said..I think thats really scary.

    There is no switch to flip to go from child to adult...it happens gradually. Yes we have to make laws about some things...because you simply have to define an age, there is no way around that, it would be completely impractical to not define any age. Do you honesty believe because we had to make cutoffs for some legal issues that somehow equates to 100% independence and adulthood? Thats really...i don't know, just silly.

    I think that its really sad that people think this girl should have the same treatment as a person 3 times that 14 year old girl should have. I think its sad and totally mind-boggling that people think those two are equivalents and sad that they would purposely try to seek that out before exploring all other possibilities.
    Last edited by KimPossible; 06-04-2013 at 08:38 AM.

  7. #47
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    20,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mom2robbie View Post
    If someone had come to my parents when I was 18 about something that I was doing my parents would have told them to talk to me. While I still lived at home and had rules I was responsible for my actions and the consequences.
    You had rules? See, i'm a full grown actual real adult now...and i don't have any rules from my parents to follow.

    most 18 year olds are not adults in any sort of real sense. They are somewhere in between.
    Alissa_Sal likes this.

  8. #48
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    20,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    I still had rules (So did DH), but I made a lot of my own decisions.
    Another one of these strange "100% Full adults" who had parental rules to follow

  9. #49
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    20,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mom3girls View Post
    I hope she doesnt get off because the jury decides that they dont like way the parents handled it
    I don't want a jury to decide that either. Now that the law is involved, i think they have to follow it.

  10. #50
    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    20,290

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    Thinking more about this, why does it matter or not if the parents approved? What if it was the 40 year old man and the 14 year old girl? Would it then be ok if the parents of both parties approved? (I know it used to be this way, and can still be this way in other cultures) Abuse is abuse whether or not the parents approve. I believe going to the police was the appropriate course of action.
    LOL it doesn't matter that the parents approved. Thats what you think i'm saying? That I think the 14YO's parents should have gone to the 18YO's to say "Hey...i was just wondering if you were okay with this...because if you are then thats cool with me then"

    Thats not what i'm saying at all.

    ETA: And for the record...i don't think they should be treated as a developmentally disabled person. But i do think they should be treated like an 18 year old high school student having sex with another high school student and NOT like a 40 year old having sex with a high school student.

    Interesting to think that treating her like one extreme (developmentally disabled) seems so ridiculous...yet going to the other extreme (A 40 year old) doesn't.
    Last edited by KimPossible; 06-04-2013 at 08:28 AM.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 5 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
v -->

About Us | Contact Us | Privacy Policy | Sitemap | Terms & Conditions