Gay Cure Ban Going Up For Vote in CA - Page 13
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Thread: Gay Cure Ban Going Up For Vote in CA

  1. #121
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ethanwinfield View Post
    1. We are talking about homosexual males and females who want to be "cured" so they are heterosexual males and females.
    2. You are citing a reason for gay men to not engage in an activity because it increases their risk for a specific type of cancer. However heterosexual females are at a higher risk of getting that cancer.

    It just doesn't convince me to say "you shouldn't be a gay man because [XYZ]" yet others who aren't gay men have a higher (or similar) rate of [XYZ].
    So since the chance of getting lung cancer in men is higher than women, is it ok for women to smoke because thier risk of getting cancer is still lower than the risk for men?
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  3. #123
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    I think that proof is going to start becoming available as we see this therapy picking up steam in the conservative communities. And we, as a society, do have a right to tell parents that they can't abuse their children. Forcibly trying to make a child think that he is not the person he believes himself to be is nothing short of abuse. Why not gouge out your child's eyes if they aren't blue or brown or whatever color you think eyes should be? We wouldn't allow that, so why allow a purported therapist to gouge out their souls?
    Whatever you think might happen... it hasn't. It isn't abuse and there is no proof that it is despite your opinion. And that really is the point that those who are religious do care about their child's soul and no one has the right to infringe on their religious freedom to teach that child that their behavior is wrong.
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  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    No one is asking you to use it if you don't feel it is effective. There are ex-gays who have used it that disagree that it is effective. Since you don't believe it is possible for a gay person to change no matter what they say of course you don't think it could be effective. Though I don't really understand that because there are plenty of teens who may struggle with sexual identity and identify as gay for a period of time and change their mind later as they mature. But regardless there is NO proof that it is harmful and no one should be telling parents what therapy they can use for thier child.
    "Ex-gays" indeed. They are choosing to move forward and pretend they aren't gay now that "treatment" has convinced them that what they are is wrong and bad. Hardly a positive, since it is not neither.

    And I agree that teens can struggle and come out on either end. I think there's a continuum and people fall at different places on it. I've had friends who identified as bisexual for a while and then ended up realizing that their preference for one gender was a lot stronger. I think there are people who are somewhere in the middle, and they have more choice than the rest of us. The only advantage I see to being straight over gay is societal/legal, plus the ability to have children naturally if you desire, although of course many straight couples can't do that either.

    I do indeed believe it is harmful to teach someone that what they are is wrong when it isn't.

    The Damaging Practice of Conversion or Reparative Therapy | Faith in America

    Every reputable health organization in the country condemns conversion or reparative therapy, including the American Psychological and Psychiatric Associations, the American Medical Association, and the National Organization of Social Workers, the American Academy of Pediatrics, and the American Psychoanalytic Association.

    American Academy of Pediatrics (1993)
    ?Therapy directed specifically at changing sexual orientation is contraindicated, since it can provoke guilt and anxiety while having little or no potential for achieving changes in orientation.?

    American Medical Association (2003)
    ?Our AMA opposes the use of ?reparative? or ?conversion? therapy that is based on the assumption that homosexuality per se is a mental disorder or based upon the a priori assumption that the patient should change his/her homosexual orientation.?

    American Psychoanalytic Association (2000)
    ?Psychoanalytic technique does not encompass purposeful efforts to ?convert? or ?repair? an individual?s sexual orientation. Such directed efforts are against fundamental principles of psychoanalytic treatment and often result in substantial psychological pain by reinforcing damaging internalized homophobic attitudes.?

    American Psychiatric Association (199
    ?The American Psychiatric Association opposes any psychiatric treatment, such as reparative or conversion therapy, which is based upon the assumption that homosexuality per se is a mental disorder or based upon the priori assumption that a patient should change his/her sexual homosexual orientation.? The APA removed homosexuality from its list of disorders in 1973.

    American Psychological Association (1997)
    ?No scientific evidence exists to support the effectiveness of any of the conversion therapies that try to change sexual orientation.? The association removed homosexuality from its list of disorders in 1975.

    National Association of Social Workers (2000)
    ?People seek mental health services for many reasons. Accordingly, it is fair to assert that lesbians and gay men seek therapy for the same reasons that heterosexual people do. However, the increase in media campaigns, often coupled with coercive messages from family and community members, has created an environment in which lesbians and gay men often are pressured to seek reparative or conversion therapies, which cannot and will not change sexual orientation. Aligned with the American Psychological Association?s (1997) position, NCLGB believes that such treatment potentially can lead to severe emotional damage. Specifically, transformational ministries are fueled by stigmatization of lesbians and gay men, which in turn produces the social climate that pressures some people to seek change in sexual orientation. No data demonstrate that reparative or conversion therapies are effective, and in fact they may be harmful.
    (excuse the question marks, that happened in the cut & paste)
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  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    I think that proof is going to start becoming available as we see this therapy picking up steam in the conservative communities. And we, as a society, do have a right to tell parents that they can't abuse their children. Forcibly trying to make a child think that he is not the person he believes himself to be is nothing short of abuse. Why not gouge out your child's eyes if they aren't blue or brown or whatever color you think eyes should be? We wouldn't allow that, so why allow a purported therapist to gouge out their souls?
    Not wanting your child to engage in any (straight or not) sexual relationship before the age of 18 is not abuse. As a parent you have the right to not allow your child to engage in any romantic relationship. You are not denying any basic human right to allow your child to date gay or straight. As an adult, if you want to pursue sexual relationships it is completely different than not allowing your child to. Are you going to say that it is abuse to not allow your child to engage in tons of different sexual relationships risking a host of diseases? The government does not have any business telling parents who and when their child is allowed to date. I would not encourage my children to have any sexual relationship (straight or not) before the age of 18. That is not abuse.

    ~Bonita~

  6. #126
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    I guess we are back now to the theory that I must hate gays now because I don't agree with their lifestyle. We have completed the circle in this debate again now its time for the name calling to start.

    Our culture has accepted two huge lies: The first is that if you disagree with someone’s lifestyle, you must fear them or hate them. The second is that to love someone means you agree with everything they believe or do. Both are nonsense. You don’t have to compromise convictions to be compassionate.”
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  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    Not wanting your child to engage in any (straight or not) sexual relationship before the age of 18 is not abuse. As a parent you have the right to not allow your child to engage in any romantic relationship. You are not denying any basic human right to allow your child to date gay or straight. As an adult, if you want to pursue sexual relationships it is completely different than not allowing your child to. Are you going to say that it is abuse to not allow your child to engage in tons of different sexual relationships risking a host of diseases? The government does not have any business telling parents who and when their child is allowed to date. I would not encourage my children to have any sexual relationship (straight or not) before the age of 18. That is not abuse.
    I'm confused by this. What does that have to do with being gay?

    Again -- you can be gay or straight (or bi) without ever having sex. I was still straight during long periods of time when I wasn't dating (or having sex with) anyone. It didn't make me any less heterosexual.
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  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    I guess we are back now to the theory that I must hate gays now because I don't agree with their lifestyle. We have completed the circle in this debate again now its time for the name calling to start.
    Gay is not a lifestyle. It's a sexual orientation. I know lots of gay people who live very different lifestyles from each other. Some are polar opposites in terms of lifestyle.
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  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddieflounder101 View Post
    "Ex-gays" indeed. They are choosing to move forward and pretend they aren't gay now that "treatment" has convinced them that what they are is wrong and bad. Hardly a positive, since it is not neither.
    It's a good thing that we have thought police around that can tell what they are really thinking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    I think that proof is going to start becoming available as we see this therapy picking up steam in the conservative communities. And we, as a society, do have a right to tell parents that they can't abuse their children. Forcibly trying to make a child think that he is not the person he believes himself to be is nothing short of abuse. Why not gouge out your child's eyes if they aren't blue or brown or whatever color you think eyes should be? We wouldn't allow that, so why allow a purported therapist to gouge out their souls?
    Quote Originally Posted by freddieflounder101 View Post
    I'm confused by this. What does that have to do with being gay?

    Again -- you can be gay or straight (or bi) without ever having sex. I was still straight during long periods of time when I wasn't dating (or having sex with) anyone. It didn't make me any less heterosexual.
    It was in response to someone saying not allowing your child to act gay is abuse. It is not, and saying so is very offensive.

    ~Bonita~

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