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  1. #91
    Posting Addict Rivergallery's Avatar
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    nvm
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  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by mom3girls View Post
    I completely agree, and I also think both sides are not really willing to sit and listen to the other side. I believe both sides want the same thing, for people to stop being murdered with guns. They just have differing opinions on how to get there. I think that is why I am so saddened by the socially accepted stereotype of gun owners, I think it shuts the non gun owners minds down to seeing that responsible gun owners do not have to be targeted

    Can you think of many solutions offered up by the pro gun side? Because truly, I can't. I can't think of a single "solution" that you or Rivergallery or Gloria have offered. I can't think of any that the NRA or Republicans have offered. (except buy more guns?). So no, I don't believe that both sides DO want the same thing, because frankly I don't see it. You can pay lip service to it all you (general you) want, but without DOING anything about it, in any way, other than buy more guns, faster, and fight background checks or rules limiting guns which can mow down tons of people in seconds, well, no, no one believes that you want the same thing that anti gun people do. So yes, that is absolutely what perpetuates the stereotype, and at that point it isn't really stereotyping, its just fact.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Thank you!!!! I've bolded and asked Gloria this twice now and to no avail. Is 30k plus truly a "good" number to you because it's such a small percentage of guns owned?

    This is where I admit my stereotyping kicks in. Paranoia and wanton disregard for human life are truly hard for me to grasp- and all I hear about is "rights" - I have yet, in probably a thousand posts on the topic, seen a NRA supporter or very pro gun person make any sort of solution or concession that would protect people. So yea- I then lose respect for their stance on the issue.
    Of course it is sad that there are 31,000 murderers out there who want to kill people. That is exactly why we need guns to protect ourselves from those 31,000 killers. Taking a gun out of my hands or away from any other law abiding citizen isn't going to stop even 1 of those 31,000 killers from killing someone.
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  4. #94
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    dp

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    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Of course it is sad that there are 31,000 murderers out there who want to kill people. That is exactly why we need guns to protect ourselves from those 31,000 killers. Taking a gun out of my hands or away from any other law abiding citizen isn't going to stop even 1 of those 31,000 killers from killing someone.
    I didn't ask if you thought it was a happy statistic. I asked if its an acceptable statistic. Lets cut to the chase.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    The problem is you can't do something about that problem specifically because it is so rare that regular people will be punished in the process. Out of 62 mass shootings since 1982, 20 used rifles that they are calling assault weapons. So you are going to punish over 3 million people who own AR15's not counting those who have similar guns because 20 were used in mass shootings in a 31 year span?

    "punished". Like, do you feel "punished" that you can't own grenades, Gloria? Do you feel punished that you can't play with rocket launchers, or chemical weapons on your private propetry? I don't think that you do, or should.

    Did you feel "punished" after 911 when Bush passed the Patriot Act and your freedoms were limited? When airport security was forever changed? When flying out of certain airports you were forbidden to leave your seat for 30 minutes, even if you had a bathroom emergency? Just because of something "so rare" like the 911 attacks? That attack killed 1/10 of the people killed in ONE YEAR from guns.

    And I SOOOOO Don't buy this "you can't do something about that problem". The UK did. Australia did. You really don't believe in American ingenuity THAT much? Very unpatriotic of you, Gloria. Very cowardly.
    Last edited by Potter75; 05-07-2013 at 06:31 PM.

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    Last edited by Potter75; 05-07-2013 at 04:52 PM.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Of course it is sad that there are 31,000 murderers out there who want to kill people. That is exactly why we need guns to protect ourselves from those 31,000 killers. Taking a gun out of my hands or away from any other law abiding citizen isn't going to stop even 1 of those 31,000 killers from killing someone.

    Sad? So there is nothing that we can do in your view but buy some tissues, be sad, and arm up? Because the big bad
    "killers" are unstoppable via any other method but people like you and your gun?

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Sad? So there is nothing that we can do in your view but buy some tissues, be sad, and arm up? Because the big bad
    "killers" are unstoppable via any other method but people like you and your gun?
    Absolutely. Australia and UK are COMPLETELY different because the general populace never had guns to begin with. There IS NO WAY that everyone is going to turn their guns in, especially the criminals. Not gonna happen even if it wasn't UNCONSTITUTIONAL. So if a killer shows up in my house with a gun there is no way to stop them other than having a gun. Sure the police MIGHT show up in time to save me, but I really doubt it since we live in a rural area so it would take them probably 20 minutes at least to get there. By that time I or my kids would be dead.
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  10. #100
    Posting Addict Rivergallery's Avatar
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    Ok I think we also need to throw into the debate the number of times guns are used for self-protection, and put that on the po
    sitive side of the equation.
    I know this is wiki.. but I think valid enough for the argument as it gives a wide range.

    Studies place the instances of guns used in personal defense as low as 65 thousand times per year, and as high as 2.5 million times per year. Under President Clinton, the Department of Justice conducted a survey in 1994 that placed the usage rate of guns used in personal defense at 1.5 million times per year, but noted this was likely to be an overestimate.[82]
    DH-Aug 30th 1997 Josiah - 6/3/02 Isaac 7/31/03

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