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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post

    provides you insurance
    Asking an honest question. Why? Why is that a good idea? Why is it not a better idea to pay your employees money that they then do what they see fit with? Why is it ok that only the people that are full time employed can buy health insurance? Why is it that a company that has moral objections to paying for something can't pay money instead.

    For example, say for whatever reason I had an objection to sending flowers at a funeral (I don't know anyone who has a moral objection to flowers, but say someone did), I could send money instead. Why would this be a problem? It wouldn't be. It probably would be appreciated a lot more. Why can an employer just pay their employees, and then let the employees buy what they see fit? There would be no employers needing to pay for things that they disagree with, and everyone would be able to participate, not just those that are full time employed with a large business.

    Maybe I am overlooking an obvious reason, but I am not seeing why it has to be this way. To me, it is a very broken system.

    ~Bonita~

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post
    I'm assuming that HL isn't covering the insurance premium 100%. If they are that is really nice but they don't have to. I still pay into my premium too so I'm not really getting something for nothing. Generic BCP is free and fluoride under the age of 6 is free routine physicals/gyn/hearing and vision are free (well no additional cost to me). Otherwise I pay towards all of my services.

    I don't feel entitled at all. I work darn hard at my job and have earned these benefits.
    You are right. You work for those benefits. Your work is traded for something you find valuable. Their religious beliefs are more valuable to them than their company. You guys need to take a good long look in the mirror because this isn't going to be the only company to go out of business because of the bad decisions you made when you pressed those buttons. It's not going to be the only backlash that they didn't print on their campaign ads. Wait until doctors are paid so little for services that they choose not to get trained on those services. Then complain because someone had to pay $40 out of pocket for plan B.

    You do feel entitled. You just made it sound like not having maternity coverage paid for by your employer was something that should never happen. Ridiculous. You may work for it and earn it, but that doesn't mean you don't feel entitled.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    Asking an honest question. Why? Why is that a good idea? Why is it not a better idea to pay your employees money that they then do what they see fit with? Why is it ok that only the people that are full time employed can buy health insurance? Why is it that a company that has moral objections to paying for something can't pay money instead.

    For example, say for whatever reason I had an objection to sending flowers at a funeral (I don't know anyone who has a moral objection to flowers, but say someone did), I could send money instead. Why would this be a problem? It wouldn't be. It probably would be appreciated a lot more. Why can an employer just pay their employees, and then let the employees buy what they see fit? There would be no employers needing to pay for things that they disagree with, and everyone would be able to participate, not just those that are full time employed with a large business.

    Maybe I am overlooking an obvious reason, but I am not seeing why it has to be this way. To me, it is a very broken system.
    In the simplest of terms that would be fine with me personally. But the employer must increase pay to equal what they would pay towards the premiums.

    It also takes into account that people aren't going to use it for insurance. This country is in a healthcare crisis and not having people paying into a health insurance pool because they aren't sick is not going to help those that have pre existing conditions.

    There is a lot of little bits into why that really wouldn't work although it would be great if it did.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post
    Well, I guess that is more on Hobby Lobby's conscience isn't it. What would God say about these people being directly put out of jobs? Terrible.
    I believe someone already asked this, but I did not see an answer. How far are you willing to go in allowing the government to force a company they feel is morally wrong? If the government said that all companies need to stop work 5 times a day to pray? If the government said that a business needed to pass out and pay for Bibles to all of their employees? If the government said a company could not pay an employee more than minimum wage? If the government said that health insurance could not pay for any kind of birth control or reproductive care? How far are you willing to go in allowing the government to make rules for individual companies that go against their morals?

    ~Bonita~

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by wlillie View Post
    You are right. You work for those benefits. Your work is traded for something you find valuable. Their religious beliefs are more valuable to them than their company. You guys need to take a good long look in the mirror because this isn't going to be the only company to go out of business because of the bad decisions you made when you pressed those buttons. It's not going to be the only backlash that they didn't print on their campaign ads. Wait until doctors are paid so little for services that they choose not to get trained on those services. Then complain because someone had to pay $40 out of pocket for plan B.

    You do feel entitled. You just made it sound like not having maternity coverage paid for by your employer was something that should never happen. Ridiculous. You may work for it and earn it, but that doesn't mean you don't feel entitled.
    I have to pay 50.00 for plan b....but it's covered.

    Again, I haven't experienced anything like that here and we have mandated insurance so my experience is that no it wouldn't happen.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    I believe someone already asked this, but I did not see an answer. How far are you willing to go in allowing the government to force a company they feel is morally wrong? If the government said that all companies need to stop work 5 times a day to pray? If the government said that a business needed to pass out and pay for Bibles to all of their employees? If the government said a company could not pay an employee more than minimum wage? If the government said that health insurance could not pay for any kind of birth control or reproductive care? How far are you willing to go in allowing the government to make rules for individual companies that go against their morals?
    Companies shouldn't have morals. They are not people. Owners may have morals. They are people. Individual people do not have a say in what other people do when it isn't hurting them.

  7. #127
    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post
    Companies shouldn't have morals. They are not people. Owners may have morals. They are people. Individual people do not have a say in what other people do when it isn't hurting them.
    If you were forced to buy someone a gun that you knew was going to be used for a murder would that hurt you?
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  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post
    Companies shouldn't have morals. They are not people. Owners may have morals. They are people. Individual people do not have a say in what other people do when it isn't hurting them.
    I disagree. If someone wants to live the American Dream and builds a company from sweat and hard work and pours their whole life into and then they succeeds and finally have a company, the Government should not be able to come in and completely take it over and mandate that they do all kinds of things that go against their principles. Basic rules for safely are needed. Government coming in and taking control is not.
    Rivergallery likes this.

    ~Bonita~

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    So you would compare murder to laying someone off? I'm pretty sure their conscience will be clear if they are forced out of business.

    Well, you haven't yet answered the question as to why you don't mind paying for state or government sanctioned murder (of actual living breathing adults) via your tax dollars. Could you address that and how you reconcile that with your conscience?

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers View Post
    I disagree. If someone wants to live the American Dream and builds a company from sweat and hard work and pours their whole life into and then they succeeds and finally have a company, the Government should not be able to come in and completely take it over and mandate that they do all kinds of things that go against their principles. Basic rules for safely are needed. Government coming in and taking control is not.
    Then your problem is with the law for them providing health insurance not for the birth control portion. I can work with you and debate much better if we are debating whether it should be law that it is something an employer should provide.

    However, right now it is law. They have to provide it. Therefore, I don't think they should get to pick and choose what they feel is right as the owner.

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