Military or Civilian Justice system?
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Thread: Military or Civilian Justice system?

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    Community Host wlillie's Avatar
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    Default Military or Civilian Justice system?

    http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/04/04/gua...als/index.html

    Which do you think is more likely to bring about justice?

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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    I don't like the idea of the military justice system being imposed on anyone who isn't in the military. But I also don't like the idea that these monsters are still sitting in one of our prisons TEN FREAKING YEARS after murdering thousands of Americans. So I guess I have to say something I don't often say: I don't know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    I don't like the idea of the military justice system being imposed on anyone who isn't in the military.
    These "people" declared war on us and should face military justice.

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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    These "people" declared war on us and should face military justice.
    We are not at war, at least not legally. So please show me where in the Uniform Code of Military Justice it says that there is jurisdiction.
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    Mega Poster Gina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    We are not at war, at least not legally. So please show me where in the Uniform Code of Military Justice it says that there is jurisdiction.

    We were attacked by foreigners. But anyway, they should NOT get the same rights as American's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    We are not at war, at least not legally. So please show me where in the Uniform Code of Military Justice it says that there is jurisdiction.
    They were at war against us whether we declared war on them or not.
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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    In our country, everyone -- even foreigners, even suspected terrorists, even people who hate us so much they want to blow us off the planet, everyone -- is entitled to a fair and public trial before a jury of peers. A military trial is closed to the public, the records are generally sealed, and there's a very good question about whether the death penalty could be applied even with a guilty verdict but that's probably a better issue for another debate. Prisoners of war are the only non-military people who are supposed to be subject to military trial, and there are very specific definitions of what constitutes a prisoner of war. Individual persons who are not acting as part of an organized miltary, militia, or organized volunteer resistance, are not considered prisoners of war. Deciding that these people are POWs just because we don't like them or what we did is a slippery slope I don't want to be on!
    Check out Article 4 of the Geneva Convention. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Geneva_Convention
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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    In our country, everyone -- even foreigners, even suspected terrorists, even people who hate us so much they want to blow us off the planet, everyone -- is entitled to a fair and public trial before a jury of peers. A military trial is closed to the public, the records are generally sealed, and there's a very good question about whether the death penalty could be applied even with a guilty verdict but that's probably a better issue for another debate. Prisoners of war are the only non-military people who are supposed to be subject to military trial, and there are very specific definitions of what constitutes a prisoner of war. Individual persons who are not acting as part of an organized miltary, militia, or organized volunteer resistance, are not considered prisoners of war. Deciding that these people are POWs just because we don't like them or what we did is a slippery slope I don't want to be on!
    Check out Article 4 of the Geneva Convention. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Geneva_Convention
    Sounds organized to me.
    Al-Qaeda ( /ælˈkaɪdə/ al-KY-də or /ælˈkeɪdə/ al-KAY-də; Arabic: القاعدة‎, al-qāʿidah, "the base"), alternatively spelled al-Qaida and sometimes al-Qa'ida, is a militant Islamist group founded sometime between August 1988[6] and late 1989.[7] It operates as a network comprising both a multinational, stateless army[8] and a radical Sunni Muslim movement calling for global Jihad.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Qaeda
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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    "Organized" is one thing. Organized as a military, militia, or volunteer resistance corps is quite another.
    4.1.2 Members of other militias and members of other volunteer corps, including those of organized resistance movements, provided that they fulfill all of the following conditions:
    • that of being commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates;
    • that of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance (there are limited exceptions to this among countries who observe the 1977 Protocol I);
    • that of carrying arms openly;
    • that of conducting their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war.
    Some of the central principles underlying laws of war are:
    • Wars should be limited to achieving the political goals that started the war (e.g., territorial control) and should not include unnecessary destruction.
    • Wars should be brought to an end as quickly as possible.
    • People and property that do not contribute to the war effort should be protected against unnecessary destruction and hardship.
    These people are terrorists. I'll agree to that. These people attacked us, but they didn't do it as an act of war. They did it as an act of terrorism. They are not POWs under any reasonable interpretation, including that of the Attorney General of the U.S. And as terrorists and not POWs they need to be tried in a court of law, not in a military court. But as I said earlier, I'm so ticked off that it's taken this long, and I'm glad to see that we will *finally* prosecute this case. Although with the closed trial, sealed records, I don't know... could spell trouble later with those in the world who want to avenge them, kwim?
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    Mega Poster Gina's Avatar
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    so if we aren't at war "legally" do the Geneva Convention pertain to terrorists?

    Protected persons are entitled, in all circumstances, to respect for their persons, their honour, their family rights, their religious convictions and practices, and their manners and customs. They shall, at all times, be humanely treated, and shall be protected, especially against all acts of violence or threats thereof and against insults and public curiosity. Women shall be especially protected against any attack on their honour, in particular against rape, enforced prostitution, or any form of indecent assault. Without prejudice to the provisions relating to their state of health, age and sex, all protected persons shall be treated with the same consideration by the Party to the conflict in whose power they are, without any adverse distinction based, in particular, on race, religion or political opinion. However, the Parties to the conflict may take such measures of control and security in regard to protected persons as may be necessary as a result of the war

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