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Maybe all the "Christian" parents need to see why their kids are picking on someone for not being like them. NOT very Jesus like
Maybe all the Christian parents, who are so insistent on their kids seeing this show, should take them one day for family time and explain how this shows their ideas and belief system vs. the other way around.
There is no way that any public school should have anything to do with the charlie brown christmas special. The very fact that it is called a christmas play is too much for me. Not to mention how the whole idea of the whole story is christian related, but there are actual bible verses in it. Way too far for public school.
The idea of keeping your kid home if you don't agree with it is downright crazy. So the school should be allowed to break the rule and if anyone actually expects the school to play by the rules then THEY should be the one that has to take their kid out of school? That's nuts. What if the school wanted to go to a muslim place of worship, for a play based on a muslim holiday, with verses from the qoran? Would anyone call parents that complained a douchebag then? Tell them to keep their kids home?
Public school is supposed to have nothing to do with religion. Holiday play, awesome. Christ based play in a church? SOOO not for a public school. Period. This is not a gray area.
Give me a second to get my jaw off the floor. Do you really feel this way?Quote:
Originally Posted by smsturner
Alyssa, I like you, and I don't want to offend you, but yes, I really do. It's a religious holiday. Religion and schools are, by law, to be totally kept separate.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers
ETA:
And it's not just the christian religion that I'm against being in schools. I'm not just picking on christians. I don't want any of them in there. It's in the laws.
I think sometimes people forget what the wording is in the Constitution.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Constitutional Topic: The Constitution and Religion - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net
I think you posted in the wrong debate lillie. The constitution vs rights one is the one about the birth control right now. This doesn't make even one tiny bit of sense posted here....
When a school that is funded by public funds presents a Christmas show that does have a lot of religious verses and tones in it and is being performed in a church it essentially is establishing a religion. It does show that X is the belief here and it shouldn't.
I do not believe there is anything inherently wrong with the word Christmas. (Separate from the issue of Charlie Brown as it admittedly has about Jesus in it) Do you call Christmas trees Holiday Trees? Do you think that no school should be able to have a Christmas tree? What about Halloween? That used to be a Pagan holiday. Over the years it has changed to just a fun time. Is it wrong for schools to celebrate Halloween, or do they need to change the name? I went to Public School in NY State all growing up. Every year we had a Christmas concert and a Christmas break from school. I see nothing wrong with the word Christmas, that it would offend someone to have any play that was labeled a Christmas play.Quote:
Originally Posted by smsturner
Do you think nothing of a cultural or historical importance should be studied in school? Odd to me that one of the best selling book in the entire world can not be quoted or a common popular play viewed just because of a scriptural reference. This country might not focus on religion now, but a huge part of our past they did. Are we supposed to chop those years out of our past and pretend they did not happen or that there is no religious aspect to our history?
I remember when I was in high school being surprised in Choir that one of the songs was a Religious song. I asked the teacher about it. She told me that it was a musical master piece and that we still needed to study it. We were not studying the religion, but the music. I believe the same could be done of a religious drama. Not studying the religion, but studying the drama and the skills and weaknesses of the actors.
I'm not offended by the word christmas at all. I just believe that it's religious and religion has no place in our schools. I do think that these days the meaning of christmas is changing to be more cultural and less religious. Which makes it a little more acceptable in schools. But then there is the big fight and the cries of war on christmas which tries to put the 'christ back in christmas', which throws it right back into religious territory.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlyssaEimers
Halloween WAS a pagan holiday. A few hundred years ago. I think we can safely say that no one celebrates it in true traditional pagan fashion, and celebrates it for it's pagan roots.
We do not do any other religion's holidays in school. Why should christmas be different?
Studying the cultural and historical aspects of religion is far different than attending a christmas play for fun. You can study the role that catholisism has played in Europe without taking the kids to see Charlie Brown's Christmas. I want my kids to learn about religion. I have a super baptist background and I have learned the bible back to front. I wish that I had more knowledge about islam and judaism. But I think that should be a personal choice on the part of parents.
As far as the constitution....I haven't seen where anyone said that church should stay out of school and that it says so in the constitution. But our supreme court has ruled again and again and again about keeping it out. What we think doesn't matter in the law. What our supreme court justices think does matter for our laws. And honestly, I don't understand why anyone who is for smaller government would want our schools to decide what religion our kids should be. Shouldn't we want the government and schools out of our religious decisions??