Replacing teachers
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    Default Replacing teachers

    Had any of you heard about this?? I'm absolutely repulsed at the actions of the charged teachers, but what do you think about replacing all the staff? Is it necessary? A lot of innocent people are going to lose their jobs and like the article mentions, teaching jobs aren't easy to find (which makes it possible for them to do a total replacement of staff).

    http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/02...abuse-charges/

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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    That article has quite a different tone to it than the information I heard on our local news last night. I heard that the staff at that school is being replaced, not fired, which is what this article seems to be saying. Firing dozens of innocent teachers would just be wrong. Why not swap those teachers for teachers from other schools in the district? Firing all the teachers is quite likely illegal. You can't be punished for someone else's misdeeds, which is exactly what they would be doing. I understand the need to regain the trust of parents, but you don't do that by firing innocent people. There's no evidence that anyone "looked the other way" or didn't report things they saw, so they do not deserve to be fired.
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    This is a difficult one. It's going to cause one heck of a mess all the way around. Teachers who haven't done anything wrong are being reassigned through no fault of their own. Students who have bonded with teachers are going to have that disruption too. It's pretty late in the school year to do all this. The article made it sound like new teachers would be hired to fill their spots which more than likely means temporary teachers and/or subs. They'll be gone next year and teachers from other sites transferred in. Another disruption for students.

    If I understand it right, the first teacher hasn't been there at all this year.

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    Even swapping those teachers to a different school is wrong, imo. Why should people who had nothing to do with the problem have to rearrange their lives?? Granted, it is much better than being fired or displaced! But, still it seems unnecessary.

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    I think it depends on knowing more facts of the case. On the surface it seems unfair, but if there was widespread knowledge of wrongdoing, then replacement of a broken system might not be entirely out of line. It's hard to believe it would be completely isolated to just two teachers, given the nature of those charges and those who can be proven to not have reported their knowledge/suspicion should be terminated, not relocated. If they are relocating people though, rather than firing, you would have to assume (hope) it was because they had no idea of the situation and that seems unjust.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khaki View Post
    I think it depends on knowing more facts of the case. On the surface it seems unfair, but if there was widespread knowledge of wrongdoing, then replacement of a broken system might not be entirely out of line. It's hard to believe it would be completely isolated to just two teachers, given the nature of those charges and those who can be proven to not have reported their knowledge/suspicion should be terminated, not relocated. If they are relocating people though, rather than firing, you would have to assume (hope) it was because they had no idea of the situation and that seems unjust.
    I agree with your whole post. To the bolded, maybe there's a deal in place - the teachers who failed to report what they knew or suspected are being replaced and not terminated in exchange for their testimony.

    There was a case in my town back in Ontario. Prominent church figure pleaded guilty to molesting a dozen or so boys who were members of the choir. Many high-up authority figures in the church knew about the abuse but did nothing, and actually attempted to cover the abuse up so as not to tarnish the reputation of the church. Many of them had to issue public apologies or were terminated/stripped of title/banned from the church, etc. etc. etc. None of them were actually charged with any crime though, I think in part because they provided information that led to the molester's conviction.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Claire'sMommy View Post
    I agree with your whole post. To the bolded, maybe there's a deal in place - the teachers who failed to report what they knew or suspected are being replaced and not terminated in exchange for their testimony.

    There was a case in my town back in Ontario. Prominent church figure pleaded guilty to molesting a dozen or so boys who were members of the choir. Many high-up authority figures in the church knew about the abuse but did nothing, and actually attempted to cover the abuse up so as not to tarnish the reputation of the church. Many of them had to issue public apologies or were terminated/stripped of title/banned from the church, etc. etc. etc. None of them were actually charged with any crime though, I think in part because they provided information that led to the molester's conviction.
    Just like the photo worker, teachers are mandated reporters. If they suspected child abuse of any kind (including molestation), they are mandated to report it within 24 hours. They can lose their credential over failing to report and be sued civilly. They couldn't be offered a "deal" to testify or be fired.

    That said, it is highly likely that other teachers didn't know. We had an AP 10 years ago - completely blindsided everyone including his wife and kids. Some people live secret lives.

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    Here in BC, everyone is has the duty to report suspected or known child abuse or neglect.

    If they can prove other teachers knew, then those teachers should be fired. If they didn't know, then I don't see how any sort of action (firing or transferring) can be taken against them.

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    I think moving/replacing/firing the staff is absolutely crazy and unfair. As a teacher, I can tell you that I rarely have any idea about what is going on in any classroom except for mine. I'm too busy, and usually supervising students. I can't just drop into other classrooms to see what the teacher might be up to. The reality is that teachers are professionals (usually) and are solely responsible for their students for most of the school day. People come into and out of the classroom from time to time (other teachers, administrators, students from other classes) or just look in the window on the way past, but for the most part teachers are trusted to care for their students, not abuse them, and nobody is looking over their shoulder all day. And the vast, VAST majority do exactly that...take care of their students. Cases such as these are horrifying and disgusting, but thankfully pretty rare. If any teacher actually did know that this was going on and didn't say anything, there are definitely legal consequences that go well beyond just losing their job. But, I'll bet nobody in that building knew or even suspected what was going on....very few teachers....very few decent PEOPLE...would allow it to continue.

    I believe the school district feels the need to "show" that they are doing something. But, this answer it isn't fair to the innocent teachers or the students who depend on them.
    Last edited by celticbandgeek; 02-07-2012 at 08:47 PM.

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    It just amazes me that anyone would think it is a good idea to have substitute teachers take on every classroom for 1500 students.

    Hey come back on Wednesday and meet your brand new teacher!

    I know it would be a logistical nightmare, but couldn't they offer to displace students whose parents request it? Yes, there are 1500 students, but there are 448 elementary schools in LAUSD. Some would be too far away for busing but even if just 1/6 of the schools were close enough to bus to, that's only 20 students per school. Honestly I would think it would be just a small percentage who would want to pull there children over this. There are 92 teachers at this school (based on 09-10 SARC). What will the stigma be for those teachers at their new sites? Will the parents at those schools be outraged at getting a teacher from Miramonte?

    This almost reminds me of the Bud Light commercial where they make over the kitchen. The before is a bare white counter top. After is a bucket of Bud Light. It's the same kitchen. It's the same school only they can pretend like they are changing it.

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