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  1. #51
    Posting Addict boilermaker's Avatar
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    But the point is that WalMart actively works to squelch unions and keep their employees from unionizing so that they can continue this practice. My dh worked there about 10 years ago and it was amazing how prevalent the anti-union rhetoric was. He found it frightening how anti-union they were.

    Then people said "oh, there is no need for unions today-- work environments are safe and employees are fairly compensated." We just disagree. And have the facts to prove it.

    Do you think $15B in profits is reasonable? Because I don't. I'm tired of subsidizing ridiculous CEO pay and board pay and millionaires. I would prefer that we as consumers demanded better for our fellow citizens and ourselves (by taking home more pay!) I think their profits should reflect what it actually costs to run the business, which IMO includes healthcare and a living wage so that full-time employees aren't dependent upon government assistance from MY paycheck.
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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by boilermaker View Post
    But the point is that WalMart actively works to squelch unions and keep their employees from unionizing so that they can continue this practice. My dh worked there about 10 years ago and it was amazing how prevalent the anti-union rhetoric was. He found it frightening how anti-union they were.

    Then people said "oh, there is no need for unions today-- work environments are safe and employees are fairly compensated." We just disagree. And have the facts to prove it.

    Do you think $15B in profits is reasonable? Because I don't. I'm tired of subsidizing ridiculous CEO pay and board pay and millionaires. I would prefer that we as consumers demanded better for our fellow citizens and ourselves (by taking home more pay!) I think their profits should reflect what it actually costs to run the business, which IMO includes healthcare and a living wage so that full-time employees aren't dependent upon government assistance from MY paycheck.
    If enough people did not shop at Walmart they would go out of business. It is not the governments (or a unions) job to regulate how much profit a company makes or what they must pay their employees make as long as it is minimum wage. If you want to fight to raise minimum wage or boycott Walmart that is great, but you can't just single out the very successful and say we don't like how much money you have so we are going to take it away and give it to the poor.

    ~Bonita~

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    Quote Originally Posted by boilermaker View Post
    I think you are missing the point that we are trying to make (I say "we" bc Alissa and Jessica did a great job capturing what I was talking about.)

    Nobody is saying that the government should mandate that WalMart pay their employees more. What we are saying is that we should be educated consumers and demand with our collective buying power what company policies work in the open market.

    I personally will not shop at Wal-Mart. I avoid it. I make enough money that I have the luxury of making that choice. I get that my relatives who live off of social security and WIC and SNAP don't have that "luxury"-- but I vote with my dollar. I understand that either WalMart or Target or Costco actually pays a living wage or **I** as a taxpayer end of paying for it out of my check.

    This article accurately captures what we are trying to convey. It explains why Whole Foods pays their employees more than they have to, and why it is working for their company.

    Whole Foods CEO: Here

    I just think it is amazing how corporate America has duped people into thinking that paying people crap for their services is better than a living wage. And that those arguing in favor of this crap pay are people who are making the crap pay. It seriously astounds me.

    Either they pay people a living wage out of their ridiculous profits ($15B. BILLION. Do you get how much money that is?) Walmart employs $1.4M people. They could give each of their $1.4M employees a $10K bonus and still make $1B profit. I have a hard time defending their crap wages (1,400,000 * 10,000 = $14B).

    I agree with Audra, the bolded in particular. I'm amazed at how many people will defend Walmarts right to sell them cheap garbage while laughing all the way to the bank. It is honestly mind boggling.

    That said, I don't believe forcing people to join unions against their own wishes is the answer, either.
    Last edited by Potter75; 12-19-2012 at 05:31 PM.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by boilermaker View Post
    Do you think $15B in profits is reasonable? Because I don't. I'm tired of subsidizing ridiculous CEO pay and board pay and millionaires. I would prefer that we as consumers demanded better for our fellow citizens and ourselves (by taking home more pay!) I think their profits should reflect what it actually costs to run the business, which IMO includes healthcare and a living wage so that full-time employees aren't dependent upon government assistance from MY paycheck.
    So do you refuse to go to the movies because movie stars make a ridiculous amount? Do you refuse to watch baseball or football game because the players make a ridiculous amount? Why is it that is ok if a person in one of these kinds of fields make top money for being a star in their field, but if it is a business person that has worked their way up to be a CEO at the top of their field they are just greedy.
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    NO one is saying that they cannot have a crazy amount of profit. But it should not be done at the expense of their workers. Their workers should not be on welfare because they don't want to pay a living wage.

    I purposefully avoid movies of stars that I am opposed to their actions...Mel Gibson is one. I will not support his stances and his bigoted behavior by paying to see anything he is involved in. If I found out a celebrity say had a nanny who was starving because they paid them minimum wage to live in LA then yes I would be very upset at that and would boycott that person's stuff too. I use my purchasing power to provide financial support to company's that enhance our society not bring it down.
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    So do you boycott all businesses that pay their employees minimum wage or less than a living wage?

    ~Bonita~

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessica80 View Post
    NO one is saying that they cannot have a crazy amount of profit. But it should not be done at the expense of their workers. Their workers should not be on welfare because they don't want to pay a living wage.

    I purposefully avoid movies of stars that I am opposed to their actions...Mel Gibson is one. I will not support his stances and his bigoted behavior by paying to see anything he is involved in. If I found out a celebrity say had a nanny who was starving because they paid them minimum wage to live in LA then yes I would be very upset at that and would boycott that person's stuff too. I use my purchasing power to provide financial support to company's that enhance our society not bring it down.
    So do you refuse to go to any movies because the workers in the concession stand don't make a living wage and the movie stars make millions?
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  8. #58
    Posting Addict boilermaker's Avatar
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    Gloria-- you are misunderstanding. I don't have an issue with the amount of profit. I have an issue with the amount of profit made by paying people a non-living wage and having the larger society subsidize that pay with federal assistance.

    Apparently, you aren't very familiar with Hollywood or the unions that work in Hollywood. Hollywood is full of unions, from stagehands to actors, you name it. They demand a living wage for their employees (and typically they will only hire union employees to do work.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    So do you refuse to go to the movies because movie stars make a ridiculous amount? Do you refuse to watch baseball or football game because the players make a ridiculous amount? Why is it that is ok if a person in one of these kinds of fields make top money for being a star in their field, but if it is a business person that has worked their way up to be a CEO at the top of their field they are just greedy.
    There is a big difference don't you think?

    Would you begrudge a football fan who is using tax dollars to attend the game? Or if the government was subsidizing the athletes' wages? I think we would throw a fit if we were being charged $100 per seat at a football game and the players didn't earn enough money to stay off of welfare.

    It is kind of interesting though...there are some actors whose return on investment is like $14 to $1. So for every $1 the actor earns, the company is making $14 in return through consumers. It doens't seem to hurt their industry any. But we think the sky will fall if WalMart raised its wages.

    So we have a Walmart employee earning $20K a year and collects, say $10k between welfare, EIC, and MediCal. We tax payers pick up that cost so the CEO's don't have to give up any of their salary. Well, heck, it doesn't really matter if you charge me more, I'm either paying the $ on the front end by buying stuff at WalMart or the back end through my taxes.

    Oh, and don't think it's just CEOs who are "greedy." How many times do you hear people say so-and-so was greedy to hold out for a gazillon dollars of 4 years.

    POTUS doesn't even make what CEOs make. YOu're never going to convince me that CEOs have more responsibility and to more people than the president.

  10. #60
    Posting Addict boilermaker's Avatar
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    Gloria- I have nothing against millionaires. In fact, I love them. My entire line of work is based on millionaires and working with them. I literally just opened an envelope at my desk with a check for $2.5M, from a billionaire that I love and adore and admire. Guess what? He pays his employees exceptionally well and didn't make his money having the government subsidize his business model.

    It isn't about the profit. It is about not paying people enough to stay off of welfare and laughing all the way to the bank while the citizens of the USA pay the difference. I just don't get it!
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