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Thread: Sex in a Teenager's Room?

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    You seem to be very stuck on this one point, which I believe you are mis-interpreting, and you seem to be discounting the entire article because of it. I think your POV is skewed because you grew up in a happy home with good relationship role models so you really have no idea what it's like to grow up *not* seeing how a loving marriage works. And I disagree with you that "community" can provide the same thing, because you can never really see how people live & love together unless you're right there in their home with them. You're absolutely right that teenagers don't have the life experiences that adults do, and that is exactly the point. Teenagers who *are* in a good relationship can be role models for other kids not because they have some great life experience or dozens of years together but simply because they are teenagers in a good relationship. And for a young person who doesn't see that in the other relationships in her life, it might be a life-changing eye-opener.
    nah, now you are just deflecting because its awkward that I reminded you that you were the one who brought up family relationships- not me. I could just as easily say that you have no idea how growing up in a happy home with extended happy friends and family ( all of my aunts and uncles are married 30 plus years, and divorce is almost unheard of in my parents circle) impacts my view of relationships. OTHER than, of course, I can say that my kids are growing up with an abundance of healthy mentors- and according to you yours have none outside of you and your husband. So at the end of the day, I know which system I prefer. I think parents do a disservice to their children when they themselves don't cultivate healthy relationships or have friends in healthy relationships when they have children. I think that if a parent is truly relying on a TEEN to be the only beacon of health or hope to their children as they navigate adult or meaningful relationships, that parent has done their child a disservice.

    And I'm not hung up on it- I'm debating it. You keep quoting me so I keep replying. Standard debate stuff. The rest of the article isn't that interesting to me as my kids are so young so I'm not going to conjure up a bunch of fake stuff to debate. This part interests me. Me disagreeing with you isn't misinterpreting- it's having a different opinion.
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  2. #42
    Prolific Poster ftmom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Others may not want to have community- but I feel certain that having community is healthier than relying on teen romances for role modeling at the end of the day. "It takes a village" isn't something I made up.
    Nobody is arguing this point with you. But nothing in there says that having a community like Melis, is healthier than everyone elses community. Yes it takes a village, but not YOUR village. I am a different person than you, and my children are different then yours and I prioritize things differently then you. And no one said they were relying on teen romances for role modeling, not in the original article, or within the debate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    nah, now you are just deflecting because its awkward that I reminded you that you were the one who brought up family relationships- not me. I could just as easily say that you have no idea how growing up in a happy home with extended happy friends and family ( all of my aunts and uncles are married 30 plus years, and divorce is almost unheard of in my parents circle) impacts my view of relationships. OTHER than, of course, I can say that my kids are growing up with an abundance of healthy mentors- and according to you yours have none outside of you and your husband. So at the end of the day, I know which system I prefer. I think parents do a disservice to their children when they themselves don't cultivate healthy relationships or have friends in healthy relationships when they have children. I think that if a parent is truly relying on a TEEN to be the only beacon of health or hope to their children as they navigate adult or meaningful relationships, that parent has done their child a disservice.

    And I'm not hung up on it- I'm debating it. You keep quoting me so I keep replying. Standard debate stuff. The rest of the article isn't that interesting to me as my kids are so young so I'm not going to conjure up a bunch of fake stuff to debate. This part interests me. Me disagreeing with you isn't misinterpreting- it's having a different opinion.
    To the bolded: To demonstrate my point about us having different priorities as parents, I think single parents (especially mothers) do a disservice to their children when they pursue new relationships to the point that a new person is spending large amounts of time around the children. And since I think that basically living with the child is what is needed to really SHOW a child all the different parts of a relationship, then it does not surprise me at all that children of a single mother would not have full exposure to much in the way of relationships. I would hope that is how I would act if I was single.

    And again, the part that I think you are misinterpreting (I wont speak for others) is that no one is RELYing on a teen to demonstrate an adult or meaningful relationship. This mother is just saying that in retrospect she thinks it was good for her younger children to live with a committed, respectful relationship and see what that looks like from the inside.
    Kyla
    Mom to Arianna (5), Conner (3) and Trent (my baby)

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    I think parents do a disservice to their children when they themselves don't cultivate healthy relationships or have friends in healthy relationships when they have children. I think that if a parent is truly relying on a TEEN to be the only beacon of health or hope to their children as they navigate adult or meaningful relationships, that parent has done their child a disservice. .
    But sometimes it isn't possible to cultivate a healthy relationship for the children to see. It wasn't for my parents. I am fully aware of what a bad relationship or marriage looks like because, with the exception of my grandparents, I never saw a good one. They just didn't exist among my family or family friends. Everyone was single or split up. It has done me a disservice. I refused to get married so that I don't have to get a divorce. It has taken Rob 8 years of our good relationship to have me trust it enough to be willing to consider marriage. But there was nothing my parents could have done about it. They didn't have a choice. So if there were examples of good relationships among my teen friends it at least gave me hope that it could exist.
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  4. #44
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    Fuscia I was speaking directly to people who said they had no village- i dont care if people have "my" village or not- i simply believe that we all need "a" villiage. that is NOT some elite or uncommon believe much as you may try to taint my view or twist it into somethingg it isnt. And yes- like you said- it's a disservice. That's all. You prove my point. And generally parents who can't maintain any healthy relationships or make friends with anyone who can do that statistically WILL have a harder time raising children who will have healthy relationships. The stats on that are in.

  5. #45
    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    I think that if a parent is truly relying on a TEEN to be the only beacon of health or hope to their children as they navigate adult or meaningful relationships, that parent has done their child a disservice.
    Why do you keep saying that? It's flat-out wrong. She was NOT relying on a teen to show her other kids a healthy relationship, she saw it in retrospect as a bonus, to helping out her daughter's boyfriend, that her other kids *did* see a healthy relationship which she, herself, had not provided. I "get" that. And no, I don't consider my friends to be relationship mentors for my children, that's pretty weird & creepy to me. I honestly don't know whether most of them have a "good" relationship or not; I know what I see but I don't know how they live in private. And there are some that would say they have a good relationship, but it isn't a relationship I would want or would want my kids to have, like the husband working 80+ hours a week & never seeing the kids during the week. That's not a healthy relationship IMHO.
    Last edited by Spacers; 08-13-2013 at 04:02 PM.
    The number of U.S. states in which a person can marry the person they love regardless of gender: 30 and counting!

  6. #46
    Posting Addict Alissa_Sal's Avatar
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    This is a weird one for me. My first reaction is "absoLUTEly not" but I can't really logically explain why. I'm not opposed to sex before marriage, although I do want my boys to wait until they are mature enough to understand and deal with the potential consequences of sex. I kind of assume that my kids will have sex as teenagers at some point, as that seems to be the norm and I well know that it's something that I did, that my husband did, et cetera. And I want them to be safe about it, and to have the kind of relationship with me where we can talk through these issues honestly and respectfully. So all of that *should* point to me being open to them having a committed* partner stay over. But emotionally, I still feel like "hells to the no, they have to sneak around and do it when we're not home like normal kids." LOL So that's something that I will have to think more about.

    I would let my adult children and their partners stay in the same room if they came to visit, though. I figure that once they are adults and living on their own, they are plenty old enough to be treated like adults.




    *Whatever committed means at 17. I agree that I would not compare my relationships at 17 to my adult marriage, but I also know that 17 year olds can be committed to each other - my parents were engaged at 17 and have been married 34 years and counting, so I know it happens...but I still had a very different relationship with my 17 year old boyfriend (who I actually got engaged to!) than I have with my husband. And yes, part of it was age. At 17 I don't think I was emotionally ready to get into the kind of "for better or worse" relationship that I entered into with my husband.
    -Alissa, mom to Tristan (5) and Reid (the baby!)

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  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacers View Post
    And no, I don't consider my friends to be relationship mentors for my children, that's pretty weird & creepy to me. I honestly don't know whether most of them have a "good" relationship or not; I know what I see but I don't know how they live in private. And there are some that would say they have a good relationship, but it isn't a relationship I would want or would want my kids to have, like the husband working 80+ hours a week & never seeing the kids during the week. That's not a healthy relationship IMHO.
    We obviously have really different ideas of friendships. Maybe because I have so many more hours in my week to interact with my friends ~ But I know them really well AND my children spend a lot of time around my friends. I wouldn't spend time around a couple who had a volitile or ugly relationship nor would I want my kids around that. I would find it bizarre to call my good friends "friends" and have no idea if they truly had a good relationship with their husband or not. We obviously wouldn't know one another well at all. I can't imagine thinking it CREEPY to say that my children know my friends well and, being bright and naturally curious beings ~ observe how adults interact. Again, as we interact with my friends a lot of their kids are my friends kids how could my kids NOT notice how the adults treat one another? It seriously astounds me that you find that "creepy". So weird!!!!

    I guess I find it pretty judgmental of you to say that about a Dad who works 80 hours to support his family ~ heck, if you can't even know ANYTHING about the relationships of your own FRIENDS its amazing that you could know so much about stranger families.

    While we are so lucky that DH works from home and we take a ton of vacations, I do know families where the husband is working like to make partner or complete his residency ~ it won't be forever and they manage to make it work as their eyes are on the prize for the long term. were I to make a similar judgment about a Mom who works like that to support her family I bet it would not be well received. Sounds pretty ****ty of you.

    You seem to be taking this pretty personally and I'm not enjoying debating this with you, so I'll sign off. I do hope that you at some point find some people who do have healthy relationships who are important or close to your children, as I am sure they will benefit.
    Last edited by Potter75; 08-13-2013 at 04:53 PM.

  8. #48
    Posting Addict fuchsiasky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potter75 View Post
    Fuscia I was speaking directly to people who said they had no village- i dont care if people have "my" village or not- i simply believe that we all need "a" villiage. that is NOT some elite or uncommon believe much as you may try to taint my view or twist it into somethingg it isnt. And yes- like you said- it's a disservice. That's all. You prove my point. And generally parents who can't maintain any healthy relationships or make friends with anyone who can do that statistically WILL have a harder time raising children who will have healthy relationships. The stats on that are in.
    We had a village. It was full of young single parents and young broken couples who fought over their children. So it wasn't a great example of positive relationships. That is what happens when you are a teen parent sometimes. So from my perspective it would have been great to see even a teen relationship that was going well! I do understand where the OP article is coming from. I can see the benefits. But having lived it I wouldn't want to put any of my children in that position.

    Not sure if I am proving your point or not!
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  9. #49
    Posting Addict Alissa_Sal's Avatar
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    Not exactly what we were talking about, but saw this today and thought it was wonderful:

    Dear Daughter: I Hope You Have Awesome Sex | Ferrett Steinmetz

    There's a piece of twaddle going around the internet called 10 Rules For Dating My Daughter, which is packed with "funny" threats like this:
    "Rule Four: I'm sure you've been told that in today's world, sex without utilising some kind of 'barrier method' can kill you. Let me elaborate: when it comes to sex, I am the barrier, and I will kill you."

    All of which boil down to the tedious, "Boys are threatening louts, sex is awful when other people do it, and my daughter is a plastic doll whose destiny I control."

    Look, I love sex. It's fun. And because I love my daughter, I want her to have all of the same delights in life that I do, and hopefully more. I don't want to hear about the fine details because, heck, I don't want those visuals any more than my daughter wants mine. But in the abstract, darling, go out and play.

    Because consensual sex isn't something that men take from you; it's something you give. It doesn't lessen you to give someone else pleasure. It doesn't degrade you to have some of your own. And anyone who implies otherwise is a man who probably thinks very poorly of women underneath the surface.

    Yes, all these boys and girls and genderqueers may break your heart, and that in turn will break mine. I've held you, sobbing, after your boyfriend cheated on you, and it tore me in two. But you know what would tear me in two even more? To see you in a glass cage, experiencing nothing but cold emptiness at your fingers, as Dear Old Dad ensured that you got to experience nothing until he decided what you should like.

    You're not me. Nor are you an extension of my will. And so you need to make your own damn mistakes, to learn how to pick yourself up when you fall, to learn where the bandages are and to bind up your own cuts. I'll help. I'll be your consigliere when I can, the advisor, the person you come to when all seems lost. But I think there's value in getting lost. I think there's a strength that only comes from fumbling your own way out of the darkness.

    You're your own person, and some of the things you're going to love will strike me as insane, ugly, or unenjoyable. This is how large and wonderful the world is! Imagine if everyone loved the same thing; we'd all be battling for the same ten people. The miracle is how easily someone's cast-offs become someone else's beloved treasure. And I would be a sad, sad little man if I manipulated you into becoming a cookie-cutter clone of my desires. Love the music I hate, watch the movies I loathe, become a strong woman who knows where her bliss is and knows just what to do to get it.

    Now, you're going to get bruised by life, and sometimes bruised consensually. But I won't tell you sex is bad, or that you're bad for wanting it, or that other people are bad from wanting it from you if you're willing to give it. I refuse to perpetuate, even through the plausible deniability of humor, the idea that the people my daughter is attracted to are my enemy.

    I'm not the guard who locks you in the tower. Ideally, I am my daughter's safe space, a garden to return to when the world has proved a little too cruel, a place where she can recuperate and reflect upon past mistakes and know that here, there is someone who loves her wholeheartedly and will hug her until the tears dry.

    That's what I want for you, sweetie. A bold life filled with big mistakes and bigger triumphs.

    Now get out there and find all the things you f**king love, and vice versa.
    -Alissa, mom to Tristan (5) and Reid (the baby!)

    Got an opinion? We've got a board! Come join us for some lively debate on the Face Off! Debate Arena board.

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