Shoot an owl to save an owl.
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    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
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    Default Shoot an owl to save an owl.

    Since we've been heavy on politics and social issues, lets do a science and nature related debate.

    I posted on the General Discussion thread about the Barred Owl thats been hanging around my house these last few weeks. Its rekindled my old love for owls and I've been doing a lot of reading since we've first seen her in our backyard.

    Essentially, barred owls are taking over territory out west where the endangered spotted owls live and experts fear the extinction of the spotted owl. As a solution, they are trying to control the population of barred owls by shooting them. Relocating them is not a possibility because it takes too long to catch them.

    What do you think? Is this an acceptable way to manage wildilife and their habitats? Is it a reasonable thing to do or is the end of one species at the hands of another species (other than humans) something we should just learn to accept and stop meddling so much? Even if it means culturally beloved animals like the spotted owl may not exist anymore. Alternatively, have we messed up our natural habitats so much that we are obligated to try to 'fix' this whatever way possible. Is barred owls taking over this territory our fault for destroying so much of their original territory?

    To Save Threatened Owl, Another Species Is Shot : NPR

    In desperation to save the rare northern spotted owl, biologists are doing something that goes against their core ? shooting another owl that's rapidly taking over spotted owl territory across the northwest.

    "If we don't do it, what we're essentially doing, in my view, is dooming the spotted owl to extinction," says Lowell Diller, senior biologist for Green Diamond, a timber company.

    The decision to shoot the more aggressive barred owls has been wrenching for biologists and the federal government. But one of the biologists says the consequence of not stepping in would be so dire that it justifies what he calls this Sophie's Choice.

    This barred owl was removed in October from California's Hoopa Valley reservation. The barred owl is a species that threatens spotted owl recovery.i
    This barred owl was removed in October from California's Hoopa Valley reservation. The barred owl is a species that threatens spotted owl recovery.

    Courtesy of Lowell V. Diller
    A few decades ago, the plight of the spotted owl sparked an epic struggle between environmentalists and the timber industry. In 1990, the federal government put the spotted owl on the endangered species list, giving it a "threatened" designation. Protecting the bird, and the old growth forests where they nest, accelerated the decline of the logging industry in the northwest.

    At the time, small numbers of the bigger barred owls, which are native to the east, had already made their way across the continent and into historic spotted owl turf. Now, they are outcompeting spotted owls ? disrupting their nesting and eating their food.

    During the 1990s, a few barred owls showed up in an area of forest along Redwood Creek that was prime spotted owl territory. Barred owls, which reproduce much faster than spotted owls, now claim nearly all this territory. No spotted owls have nested in this stretch of forest in recent years.

    "It's very upsetting and there's nothing that's going to stop this expansion of barred owls from continuing," says Diller, who has studied spotted owls for 25 years. The only feasible solution, Diller says, forces him to go against his nature.

    "I Hate It Every Time I Go Out And Do It"

    In the forest along Redwood Creek, Diller plays a recording of a barred owl, and soon a pair of real barred owls starts hooting. Barred owls are aggressively territorial ? the birds are trying to intimidate what they think is another owl intruding on their turf.

    The female buzzes past. Then she perches in plain view, a tactic meant to ward off interlopers that puts the birds in shooting range.

    "I think you can appreciate, standing here, how easy it would be ? and when I say easy, I mean technically easy or simple ? to lethally remove that bird," Diller says.

    Diller's a hunter, but he was taught never to kill a bird of prey or anything you didn't plan to eat. At first, someone else did the shooting. But, he says, this felt hypocritical, so he started doing it himself.

    Diller recalls the first time he took a shot. "I was so nervous about what I was doing, and emotional, that I had to steady myself against a tree."

    Over the past five years, Diller has killed more than 70 barred owls with a shotgun. Each time, he says, it felt "totally wrong."

    "I hate it every time I go out and do it," he says.

    Removing barred owls without killing them is not feasible, he says. He calculates it takes more than 40 hours to catch a live barred owl ? compared to about two hours to shoot and collect one. Finding new homes for the barred owl would also be time-consuming and traumatic for the birds.

    Guns, dogs and owl-calling decoys are used in efforts to remove barred owls. The dogs are valuable in recovering fallen owls, especially at night.i
    Guns, dogs and owl-calling decoys are used in efforts to remove barred owls. The dogs are valuable in recovering fallen owls, especially at night.

    Courtesy of Lowell V. Diller
    Shoot To Save, Or Leave It To Nature?

    Barred owls are not rare. Still, shooting them has presented such a quandary to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service that it has taken more than seven years come to this solution.

    Although the agency made an exception for Diller, it's illegal to shoot barred owls, under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act.

    On the other hand, the Fish and Wildlife Service can't ignore the invasion because it's legally required to help rare species under the Endangered Species Act. The agency even hired an ethicist, Clark University's Bill Lynn, to help wildlife experts resolve the dilemma.

    "People recognized there's a crisis for the spotted owl, that barred owls are part of the cause of that crisis and, so, they reluctantly, essentially justified the experimental removal of barred owls," Lynn says.


    The Fish and Wildlife Service is starting a four-year experiment to kill up to 3,600 barred owls in the northwest.

    The birds will be removed from four different forests, two in Northern California, one in Oregon and one in Washington. Some birds will be captured but not killed.

    The federal government says if spotted owls come back after barred owls are removed, it may decide to kill barred owls over a broader area.

    An advocacy group, Friends of Animals, is suing to stop the experiment.

    The group doesn't believe the government can make a moral argument for shooting an animal, even if it would benefit another animal.

    "To go in and say we're going to kill thousands and thousands of barred owls, literally forever, I don't see that as being a solution. At some point you have to allow these species to either figure out a way to coexist or for nature to run its course," says Michael Harris, legal director of Friends of Animals.

    But Diller argues this is an "absurd thing to say" after all the ways humans have altered nature. People cut down most of the forests that used to host barred owls. They made lots of changes to the Great Plains, which he believes helped the barred owl move across the continent.

    So, he says, people should at least try to save the spotted owl. And nearly everywhere he shot barred owls, he says, spotted owls came back ? and had owlets too.


    The Reward

    Along the Mad River, Diller scrambles through a young redwood forest to track down a pair of spotted owls. He feeds them mice so he can see the bands on their legs. The polka dot markings tells him the owl settled here in 2009, after he shot barred owls nearby.

    For Diller, seeing rare spotted owls thrive in this forest is success worth the agony of shooting barred owls.

    "Probably what makes spotted owls so special is the fact that as you just witnessed, they fly right up to you," Diller says. "You get to interact with them. It's almost impossible as a biologist not to fall in love with these birds ? they're just the neatest animal."

    Diller hopes the public also will see the value in saving this beautiful creature.
    And just for fun. The owl came back yesterday too and I was able to get another great picture that I've added below, that again, all my FB friends have already seen. Sorry! I latch onto an interest and i just can't let go! I just love her! (him..her, don't really know) While i'm undecided about this controversy as a whole, i'm glad that this particular owl can live safely in my backyard!


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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    From growing up in Montana I know that you absolutely have to manage the population of the wildlife. Every year they calculate how many tags to sell for hunters for antelope, deer, elk, mountain goats, sheep, etc. If they don't manage the numbers the land cannot support them and they starve to death, especially through the winter. I remember one year when the population was too high followed by a hard winter and record numbers of deer starved to death.
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    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    From growing up in Montana I know that you absolutely have to manage the population of the wildlife. Every year they calculate how many tags to sell for hunters for antelope, deer, elk, mountain goats, sheep, etc. If they don't manage the numbers the land cannot support them and they starve to death, especially through the winter. I remember one year when the population was too high followed by a hard winter and record numbers of deer starved to death.
    But that is a different issue than this one. If left alone, this species would overtake the area and the other one would naturally die out. The are not shooting barred owls because they would otherwise starve to death. This is a matter of us choosing one species over another.

    But as an aside, the matter of shooting animals vs. letting them starve to death for population control also doesn't seem open and closed to me. Starvation is mother nature's population control..and i think it could be argued that mother nature knows better than we do. I mean do we think that animals in places that are not so heavily monitored by humans dont' ever deal with over population? When they do...how does that population become manageable again, because many of them starve to death.

    When it comes to animals like deer however, over population in havily enough populated areas becomes a safety issue. Its bad enough trying to avoid hitting deer around here as it is, with an over population it would be even worse. I hit one just a few months ago. I would not think its appropriate to manage ALL populations of animals by humans deciding how many to kill.
    Last edited by KimPossible; 02-06-2014 at 02:08 PM.

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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Aren't we part of mother nature too? Why should an animal starve to death if we could be eating it? They don't just shoot them and leave them laying there.
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    Posting Addict KimPossible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GloriaInTX View Post
    Aren't we part of mother nature too? Why should an animal starve to death if we could be eating it? They don't just shoot them and leave them laying there.
    Well for one, because we like to think we know whats best or what the right amount is....but like i said, i think mother nature knows better. Really i don't have an issue with it for animals we would naturally hunt anyway and will be used for food, or can cause serious safety problems.

    Also killing animals with the specific purpose of trying to control their population is artificial population control, not natural....so we shouldn't pretend that us trying to decided how many should exist in any given area is anyting natural or has anything to do with mother nature's ways.

    But again, this isn't even the issue the article is about anyway.
    Last edited by KimPossible; 02-06-2014 at 03:22 PM.

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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    Well I guess if mother nature knows best then let the spotted owls die out. But it is impossible for man not to have an effect on nature, look at the Africanized bees and Fire Ants that are doing pretty much the same thing as these owls. Whether we do something or don't do something, either way it is going to have an effect on what happens.
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    Mega Poster mom3girls's Avatar
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    This is an issue near and dear to me, as I have seen almost all industry die off around me due to the spotted owl. It has been 20+ years of trying to save the species. Unfortunately at every turn something has threatened the species. At first logging all "old growth" timber was banned when it was learned that the owls would not adapt and live in younger trees. Then the bark beetle came in a decimated the old growth timber, and the owls did adapt somewhat. Now the bark beetle is killing off younger trees as well, so the spotted owl population took a hit again. Then the trees that had died due to the beetle set up a record breaking fire season, causing the spotted owl numbers to drop again. Now they are threatened by the Barred owl.

    In speaking to my brother who's degree is in forestry management, and my friends husband who is a fish and wildlife biologist, I really think they need to stop killing owls and take a more hands off approach. The 2 guys really feel like the human management of the spotted owl issue all those years ago when it started caused a lot of unforeseen consequences that may have done more harm to the owl population.
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    Posting Addict GloriaInTX's Avatar
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    It completely destroyed the industry in the town where my brother lives too. Between that and the environmentalists trying to save trees the lumber mill where he worked eventually just gave up and shut down for good. It's sad that they pushed plastic for so long to save trees, and now they have decided that it is better to use paper than plastic.
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    While I think they are beautiful, I do not think they are so important that they should supersede everything else. It is important to make sure that there is a good balance and to make sure the things they eat (such as bugs and small animals) are not over run by their absence.

    I do think with deer it is important to keep the population under control. My parents have 180 acres. In the begining they limited the hunting to only themselves because they did not want any hunting accidents on their property. Now they let more people come in (still only people they know) because the deer population is so high. The people that give out hunting tags have given them extra special tags that they can give out to people that will hunt on their property to work on how over populated it is.

    ~Bonita~

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    Posting Addict Spacers's Avatar
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    The barred owl is moving west because of humans. That's the only reason. We're moving into its territory so it's moving out. So I do think we should be responsible for trying to protect the native species of the areas it moves into, or at least try to maintain a balance between the two, because it's 100% our fault the native species is in this danger. OTOH, while the barred owl is thriving in the new places it's found, the spotted owl is NOT thriving here even though it's not only the native species, it has also been protected in many, many ways for many, many years prior to the barred owl's arrival -- and it's STILL barely hanging on. Is the spotted owl just doomed, or does it just need more time? At this point, I'm open to giving the spotted owl more time by keeping the barred owls under control, but I'm also open to changing my mind about it in a few years' time.

    Quote Originally Posted by mom3girls View Post
    At first logging all "old growth" timber was banned when it was learned that the owls would not adapt and live in younger trees.
    The old growth forests were protected because they are a precious, historical, and spectacular natural resource that can never be replaced, and that effort began over a hundred years ago -- long before the spotted owl became endangered. Spotted owls can, and do, live in younger trees if there isn't an older tree available.

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