baby question - hope you don't mind

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MichiGal23's picture
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baby question - hope you don't mind

Hi ladies. I have a question regarding Max, and I hope you don't mind me posting here about it, but his BB seems to be suuuuper quiet (I guess it moved over to fb or something?). Anyways, if you don't want me asking baby related questions, that's fine. Just let me know!

But here goes: Max has a lot of trouble going to sleep at night, or rather, STAYING asleep at night. I'll give you an example of how our night "normally" goes -
7pm: bathtime for Max
7:30: 8 oz bottle while Izzie takes a bath
8: DH starts walking/bouncing/swaying with Max, he falls asleep after about 20 minutes. Meanwhile, we're working on getting Izzie to bed (usually in bed by 8:30)
We put Max in the swing for about 20 min, then transfer him to his bed, IF he stays asleep in the swing. If not, then its another 20-30 minutes of bouncing/walking/swaying to get him back to sleep and we start all over again. Once we finally get him in bed, he will still wake up in a half an hour or so, and we have to do it all over again. This continues until 11 or 11:30 when we finally cave and give him Tylenol, after that he falls asleep within 15-20 min and is usually out for the night.
Now, he's been napping great (on his tummy Beee ) and we even took away his evening nap, to see if that will help him fall asleep easier. Tried a small meal of cereal in the evening. Tried increasing formula before bed (just seemed to make him spit up more), even tried putting him to sleep on his belly! For the last week, we've ben resorting to the tylenol every nigh, because by 11:30 at night, we're exhausted and getting frustrated because this is also interfering with Izzie's sleep too.
I feel guilty about giving him the Tylenol, but it seems to help. I know there's a worry about liver damage, but how big of a risk is that? (Not trying to argue it, I'm honestly curious). How harmful or beneficial is it to be giving him Tylenol every night - after we've exhausted all other options?

Thanks for any help ladies!

isisgoddess_1's picture
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I am sorry I am not much help. When Josh was that small he had trouble falling asleep on his own. I tried sleep training him but he screamed his head off for too long so we started cosleeping and still do. Have you tried sleep training him to see if he can learn to fall asleep on his own and stay asleep?

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How much does he weigh?

This suggestion is not for everyone but based on the sleep class I took, they are able to sleep through the night at 12 pounds without feeding (providing of course they are sound of health). Have you thought about letting him cry?

It is really hard with them being so small (we let DD cry at 5 months). 12 pounds is too little in my mind so I was happy that Hayleigh was larger but if you are at wits end, give it 3 nights of crying. He might cry for over an hour but it may be worth it in the end.

Just a thought and it is definately not for everyone! PM me if you have any questions!

MichiGal23's picture
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We haven't done sleep training, or CIO, not because I'm against it or anything (we did a bit with Izzie and it worked out great for us), but because Max and Izzie share a room. And Izzie's one of those kids where if she doesn't get her sleep, she's an absolute BEAR for a couple days. Anyone have any experience with CIO and sharing a room?

And Max is above 17 pounds (he's a chunker! Haha). And he's tired, because he'll fall asleep, he just for some reason can't stay asleep for longer than 20-30 minutes at a time, and when he does wake up, its with a scared/hurt sounding cry, not just a bit of fussing. I would think maybe teething or growing pains, but this has been going on for about 2 months now! I'm at such a loss of what to do.

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"MichiGal23" wrote:

We haven't done sleep training, or CIO, not because I'm against it or anything (we did a bit with Izzie and it worked out great for us), but because Max and Izzie share a room. And Izzie's one of those kids where if she doesn't get her sleep, she's an absolute BEAR for a couple days. Anyone have any experience with CIO and sharing a room?

And Max is above 17 pounds (he's a chunker! Haha). And he's tired, because he'll fall asleep, he just for some reason can't stay asleep for longer than 20-30 minutes at a time, and when he does wake up, its with a scared/hurt sounding cry, not just a bit of fussing. I would think maybe teething or growing pains, but this has been going on for about 2 months now! I'm at such a loss of what to do.

I do. We had DD sleep with us for the first night of CIO even though Ben only cried on and off for 1/2 hr, and then the next night when Ben only cried for a few minutes before falling asleep we just kept her up a bit later and put her down in her own bed once it was 'safe'.

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I like Lisa's suggestion of having Izzie sleep with you, or maybe in the living room, just for a couple nights. Honestly to me it sounds behavioral. He's learned to fall asleep with assistance and doesn't want to do it on his own, or perhaps doesn't quite know how to do it on his own. It reminds me of how Zoey used to fall to sleep at night, and it's the reason I kept her in my room for as long as I did. She just was not a good independent sleeper (she's an awesome independent sleeper now but a terrible sleeper in general---but that's a totally different scenario). If you can find a way to keep Izzie away from him I would try CIO for a couple nights. If he's a "typical" baby he'll be falling asleep on his own very quickly. It sounds to me like he just needs to learn how to do it. :bigarmhug: I tend to be a big supporter of CIO under some circumstances. I think you'll know within a day if he's going to benefit from it. It's definitely not for some babies, but in our case a soft approach worked almost instantly.

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Lurker

Is he tired earlier than when you are putting him to bed? With DD we were trying 9pm but she was terrible. When we moved bedtime to 7pm within 3 days not only was she sleeping better but she was also starting to put herself to sleep. We did do a bit of modified CIO, but only for 7 minutes at a time. It was supposed to be 10 minute intervals but I couldn't last that long!!

Good luck!

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I'm sorry, it must be so tough for you! I agree to try to have him CIO, and Lisa and the girls gave great suggestions too. I hope it works for you. I bet you all need some sleep!

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Thanks for the suggestions. I guess it can't hurt to give it a try and see if Izzie can fall asleep out on the couch for a couple of nights. Now, with Izzie, I had the 10 minute rule where if she didn't stop crying after 10 min, then she wasn't going to sleep on her own. That maybe happened 5 times total, if that. I know that's not going to be the case with this little man. I've read a bit about the true CIO method, going in every minutes the first night, not picking him up, etc. Anyone have any suggestions/tips for CIO that would be helpful? Thanks again!

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One thing my kids have taught me is that fighting or forcing an issue isn't always the way to go. Battles need to be picked. Instead of CIO so they sleep train what you think they can do, changing things up in ways you haven't thought might work like a dream. (Especially after one kid, you think well she was sleeping through the night by now, why won't he?!")

As a relevant example, I fought with the twins about sleeping. I beg and pleaded. I cried. I prayed. I did everything I thought was right, and some I didn't. Moving their bed time to 6pm was the magic trick. Within a week I had a much happier household. They weren't sleeping all night, but they went down easy and were up just a couple times before they were up for the day. Their whole schedule shifted a bit and it worked like a charm. I honestly though the advice about shifting their schedule and trying a crazy early bed time was hogwash.

For Ana getting her to sleep in the girls room instead of ours was a challenge. I just kept trying off and on and eventually she accepted it. Sadly it wasn't when we wanted her out of our room, but it wasn't too long after either.

Have you thought about teething? IF drugs seem to make a big difference, it could be that. Tylenol & Ibuprofen were my friends off and on for a few months when teeth were being cut.

MichiGal23's picture
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We've tried moving up his bed time, backfired. While he went down fairly easy, he thought it was just a late evening nap, slept for about 40 minutes and was then up for another 3 hours before even thinking about going back to sleep.

As far as teething, as I mentioned before, this (along with growing pains) has been a thought, but he's been doing this for about 2 months straight now. He went to sleep and slept through the night like a dream for about 5 days at 3 months, and then it all turned. I know teething can go on for a while, but is it something that can bother him so much every single night for 2 months straight?

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Laura, I really took the tough love approach when it comes to CIO. We shut the door at night and do not open it until morning. If she cries at night, we let her cry (it never happens any more though).

Toys in the crib were recommended to us (although at this point Max is a little small).

There are circumstances of course that we get her (ie sickness, pain or unusual crying) but otherwise, we felt she would not learn to put herself back to sleep.

I feel that going in every ten minutes is reinforcing that they know Mom and Dad will come in eventually. It may work for some people, it wasn't working for us.

This is my experience and although some people my think it is cruel or neglectful, it was what we had to do to teach DD how to sleep. I have absolutely no regrets and she is a wonderful sleeper now.

You really need to experiment and find something that works for your family. I wish you all the best.

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Are there tummy issues or reflux going on?ie: milk allergies? just a thought about why he might cry. Is he always upset when he is on his back?

MichiGal23's picture
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He is on soy formula because of a potential milk allergy. But he does spend a lot of "happy time" on his back during the day, playing on his mat. I'm stumped.