Cranky McPhersen--update post #6

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Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007
Cranky McPhersen--update post #6

This is Oakley's nickname. I feel so bad because I don't know what is up with him. We are starting to suspect a food allergy? So I posted on the allergy board, and I'll copy that here--it was long. We are starting to get worried because he cries so much and is not gaining weight, maybe a food allergy is doing serious damage to his intestines...Here is the post...Anyone have any ideas?? I just had my 4th child in January--he is 2 months old. My older 3 kids have no food allergies but ds1 does have some hayfever and itchy eye stuff (like me) in the spring--some clariten and eye drops help tons. With #4, he has been super fussy since day 1, after the meconium poops left, he had normal looking orange, seedy poop for about a week. After that, it turned green and runny--almost watery. I kept asking the ped when we went in if green poo was ok, and she kept saying it was. But now I'm wondering if he has an allergy? He cries A LOT and has up to 10 very runny, watery green poops in a day. But he doesn't have exema or anything like that--just crying and the diarreah and some raspy breathing that never goes away. At his last visit, his weight percentage dropped way down. He did gain a little from 1-2 months, but not much. And when I compare him to my other kids, he is way smaller--they have all followed a very similar growth pattern except him, so that now, at 2 months, he is 2-3 lbs behind where they were yet he was the 2nd biggest at birth. I eliminated milk last week, and since the appt this past tuesday, I eliminated ALL dairy. He does not seem to be improving at all, so now we are trying an elimination diet to see if we can get him to be a happier baby. Basically all I have had to eat for 2 days is rice chex and soy milk. (as long as rice or soy are not the allergens, maybe this will help?) I guess my question is, would a food allergy be just fussy, low weight gain, raspy breathing and diarreah (he has had nothing but breastmilk) Or is skin rashes another definite sign of food allergies? My MIL has crohns disease, so we worried about that or celiac, but I have no experience with either one. All I know is that he is not like my other 3 kids and something is up with him.ETA--the ped put him on prevacid thinking maybe he has silent reflux (the raspy breathing) but it doesn't seem to help the fussiness at all, and does nothing for the green runs. She said the next step would be do do a super expensive formula, which i want to avoid--all my others were exclusively bf. Sad

Joined: 12/01/05
Posts: 1000

My SIL went through an allergy phase with her son. He had several allergies, so she had a very limited diet. I think I would stay away from soy and stick to meat, rice, green veggies, bananas and apples. Those are all unlikely to be allergens. The most common allergens are nuts, berries, wheat, dairy, eggs and soy. So I'd try to avoid those. Maybe try to avoid corn too. I know a few people who are allergic to corn.

I'd say if you see no improvement after a week on that diet, it may be something else going on.

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

Sorry you are dealing with this.

Just gleaning information from other threads, iy may take 2 weeks to get allergens out of the system. Also, soy is a common allergy, so it may be good stick to the basics. Be careful if you eat any processed foods because thy love to stick random things everywhere... I am allergic to onions and it's amazing what things have onions in them that you never would have thought of. Best advice is to stay away from the processed as much as possible and eat whole foods. If you can, get organic or wild meat too to avoid chemicals in your meat - I know a few people who've found that has helped with sickness and digestive problems.

Joined: 07/27/06
Posts: 722

my son was fussy and "colicky" and always had upset stomach. We muddled through until he was a year and we went from breast milk to starting to introduce whole cows milk...well his digestive system went wild. He started getting explosive poops and was very bad. We changed to soy....same thing. We went to lactaid and it stopped. He definitely has an allergy to the milk (lactose intolerant) and soy products. I did not make solid changes to my diet while breastfeeding enough to help him when he was younger....and I feel really bad about that now. The doctor just kept saying it was colic and it would go away...all the while I was torturing the poor kid! Smile Anyways...he is no worse for the wear now...he is doing great...and he actually tolerates yogurt and cheese...but its the straight milk and soy milk that is a problem. I would see if you can figure out the allergy thing first...my other son had severe reflux. He was diagnosed young (2 months)...and at the age of 6 they did a ph probe and he was diagnosed with severe reflux even then. He is 12 now and has FINALLY outgrown it...but not all kids spit up with reflux...so its another very real possibility...especially if he is not gaining properly. Good luck finding answers...but be careful not to "correct" both things at once...or you wont know which the problem was.....or maybe it will end up being both! kup!

jhj
Joined: 08/06/11
Posts: 360

I have one friend of a friend who's baby was allergic to her breast milk. I don't know what the exact symptoms were, but once they switched to formula, the baby was healthy. I really really hope this isn't the case since breastfeeding is so wonderful for babies, but just thought I'd mention it as a possibility if cutting out all allergens in your diet doesn't make an improvement.

Hope you figure it out quickly,

Heather

Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007

Update:

Went back for a weight check today. Oakley hasn't gained anything in an entire week. He is cranky and fussy all the time still and has nasty wet, mucousy green diarrhea still. I even took a pic with my phone this morning of his diaper and showed the dr. She said it looked to her more liquidy than solid and asked if it was always that mucous filled. She recommended putting him on Alimentum formula for one week and pump the entire time to keep my milk up. See if he improves. So I'm going to keep with my allergen free diet and if he improves, try nursing again and see what happens. I am off gluten, soy, diary, eggs, citrus, chocolate, all nuts and peanuts. Basically I eat rice chex and rice milk for most meals, some grilled meat and rice or potatoes and collard greens or kale for dinner. Pretty boring, but worth it if we figure it out.

If for some reason the formula doesn't take care of it, then we need to dig deeper and we'll be sent to Children's for some testing on why he is not absorbing nutrients. Ay yi yi..... Sad Makes me cry because none of my kids ever had formula--I guess my dd had a little supplement of formula at almost a year, but that it.

Joined: 01/25/02
Posts: 2023

Hugs Holly. I know I would be so sad to hear I could not bf, but I am sure it is also heartbreaking seeing your little guy so unhappy and not gaining. I hope you can get things figured out!

boilermaker's picture
Joined: 08/21/02
Posts: 1984

((HUGS)) I hope the switch helps-- I would be heartbroken, too.

Your elimination diet sounds incredible-- I hope it works! KUP and we'll be hoping that Oakley is happier soon. More ((HUGS))

Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007

Thanks ladies. I just can't stop crying about it today. It doesn't help that every time I pump I'm getting less and less. And that my sister keeps reminding me that it is fine, she couldn't nurse her babies either and they were just fine on formula.

But Oakley is happier today without tummy aches and this morning had a normal poopy diaper--orange and had some substance to it rather than liquid. And only one so far today instead of 6+. Normally he would nurse and get nice and full and within a half hour be screaming in pain and nothing would stop him--he wouldn't nurse or sleep. He would finally pass out and then wake up, poo green and be starving again.

Joined: 01/25/02
Posts: 2023

Hugs Holly. It is tough. But yay for a happier baby today! So can you slowly add things into your diet to figure out his allergies, if you get him back to nursing? Poor little guy!

Joined: 12/01/05
Posts: 1000

I'm sorry. I hope the diet works, but if it doesn't at least you know what will. Hugs!

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

Sorry that the nursing thing seems to be out, but very glad that baby is happier. I hope you can figure out allergies so you can nurse again, but if it;s actually lactose that he's unable to digest, then it's toughest on mama. Hugs!

pico83's picture
Joined: 09/06/06
Posts: 3013

:bighug: I hope the new diet works. It must be so tough not being able to BF for a week.

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

Any update on mama and baby?

Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007

"sarahsunshine" wrote:

Any update on mama and baby?

Yes--I do have an update Smile Been a nutty week--we took off for the last few days of spring break last weekend and went to the Oregon coast (from seattle area). And this week we have strep in the house--so far only ds1 has taken ill.

So the update: Oakley became such a different baby overnight on the formula. He was happy and sleeping well and his diarrhea was gone. So I pumped all week and weekend last week and saved it all (in the chance he can someday have it). I kept on my super allergy free diet. I have been off dairy for 3 weeks now, and soy, eggs, gluten, nuts, etc for 12 days. I started giving Oakley a few bottles on Sunday of pumped milk and tried nursing a little. My supply is WAY low now (horrible pump) but he seemed to do fine. So on Monday he had about half milk and half formula throughout the day---still fine! I took him in yesterday for a weight check and he had gained 17 ounces in a week--compared to the 1/4 ounce from the week before! I got the go ahead to transition him all the way back to breastmilk (though my supply is low and he often refuses to nurse now that he has had so many bottles). So I bought a medela pump and am pumping like crazy to get supply back up and giving him whatever I can pump, trying to convince him to nurse and giving formula when he won't nurse and I'm out of pumped milk. I hope to get him 100% back on breastmilk by next week and if he is still doing ok, then I'll slowly add stuff back into my diet. I just hope he will keep nursing.

Any tips on how to get a baby to not refuse the breast after having bottles? I try to only offer when I am feeling nice and full and haven't pumped in a while so that he won't get frustrated, but it takes so long for him to decide its ok to eat.

Joined: 01/25/02
Posts: 2023

Yay for a happy little Oakley that is gaining weight! That is wonderful! I hope you can slowly ease him back to the breast and figure out the allergens. I don't have any advice, beyond maybe doing a little hand pumping or with the pump to get milk flowing before you put him to breast it is already dribbling, or flowing? Good luck! Your are amazing to cut that all out of your diet!

**Tiffany**'s picture
Joined: 11/21/03
Posts: 1230

Holly he sounds like my reflux babies a bit. They didn't always have loose stools though but sometimes did. They were FF from the beginning which makes a difference in stool. Anyway they were very cranky, cried all the time w/ nothing consoling them. Eating helps most babies calm but it didn't them at all it made things worse. They tried to eat all the time but would end up crying uncobtrollably after the first burp brought burning acid up. We put them on Prevacid which really helped. Some reflux babies do really eel on Alimentum as well and end up not needing the meds. Mine wouldn't tolerate the taste of the Alimentum we ended up giving them regular formula with rice cereal to thicken it up and help hold down the reflux that was really when I started breathing a sigh of relief! It was so very hard to see my two cry like they did and very stressful to me to try to calm them all day and night. Good luck I hope he gets all better fast!

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

WONDERFUL NEWS!!!!

Glad Oakley is finally gaining!

There are a couple things that are recommended for getting babies to the breast when they have been on the bottle. One of the sneaky things that I have never used but I’ve heard lots of success with is you get a tiny tube that you tape to your breast, and goes in baby’s mouth as they nurse. The tube acts as a straw and goes into the formula/expressed milk. The goal of this is to keep stimulation to the breast (best way to increase supply), at the same time as associating feeding to the breast instead of bottle. Here’s some info on how to do this: http://pediatrics.about.com/library/breastfeeding/blbreastfeedingf.htm
There is also a you-tube video here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezGIkIkhC_o

The more common one that people try is the breast shield, but I would try the tube first since that would give the best stimulation for bringing back you milk supply, and he already knows how to nurse properly. A breast shield is usually used to help a baby latch properly and not necessarily for increasing supply, or convincing a baby to nurse rather than bottle feed.

Also, Supplementing with Fenugreek and Blessed Thistle help increase milk supply quickly and may help get your production back on track. They shold be taken together – here’s an information sheet: http://nbci.ca/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=21:herbal-remedies-for-milk-supply&catid=5:information&Itemid=17

Best of luck!

Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007

I tried a breast shield, but realized that he doesn't even really take silicone bottle nipples very well--I think he sees them as pacifiers and not food because most of the bottle nipples I have are the natural latex playtex nurser ones. So they feel different. My other kids only took those and never silicone (I think they feel closer to skin so they would take them).

Oakley actually nursed tonight! It has been 2 nights since he has. The trick I tried tonight--I gave him 2 oz in a bottle to take the edge of hunger off, then he wouldn't latch on until I stood up with him! I nursed him while standing up Smile I'll take what I can get! I'm going to keep trying. And I've been pumping a ton today to boost supply. I am going to go get those supplements tomorow. I called the only store around I figured would have them and they have fenugreek, but not the blessed thistle, but they have a mothers milk tea that has both? Would that work?

Joined: 01/11/12
Posts: 43

((hugs)) I hope you can figure out whats causing his allergies

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

Mother's milk tea will probably help. Personally I had to take a bunch of both to have an effect, but they did help. The key is taking them together. They help a TON for some people, and not too much with others.

I forgot about taking the edge off hunger with the bottle first, I did that with Leo for a while. The biggest thing to remember is taht the more you nurse, the better your milk supply will come back. I hope you are one of those lucky people that pumping stimulates production. Unfortunately, for me, it didn't.

I know you have lots of kids, but is it possible to take the weekend and simply tell your DH that you need a "two day lie in only with Oakley" and simply stay skin to skin and nurse all day with him? I found this to be the solution with Leo. It meant he never got starving, and the constant feeding meant a huge increase in supply (along with supplements). Two days of constant nursing is usually enough to give a big boost in supply. Even one helps considerably.

Joined: 07/21/02
Posts: 1007

He is doing so much better yesterday and today! He hasn't fought to nurse, though hasn't really "filled up" nursing. I have been able to boost my supply, but now he seems to be frustrated by a fast letdown, so he gets to choking and gulping and does the pop on/off thing. He is going to just give me grief in nursing isn't he? But I have been able to nurse him without fight for 3 sessions yesterday and 3 (so far) today! It seems every day is getting better. and I got some mother's milk tea. He only had 2 four oz formula bottles yesterday and didn't finish either one because he had nursed before-hand. The rest were all bm bottles and the nursing and he is still sleeping well, happy and green diarrhea FREE! Oh, and I added eggs back to my diet and all seems well so far. I'll give it a few days and add gluten back in--I'm dying for some bread!

Joined: 01/25/02
Posts: 2023

yay! I am glad Mr. Oakley is doing so well!!

sarahsunshine's picture
Joined: 11/29/06
Posts: 1462

WOOHOO!!!