Politicaly correct Chirstmas??

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Politicaly correct Chirstmas??

Okay I'm hopping we can discuss without upsetting anyone

What is your opinion on "Politicly correct Christmas'?"

Do your cards say "merry christmas or happy holidays?"

Do you have a christmas party or holiday party

Do you think its too political or not political enough, or maybe just right?

SoCaliLover's picture
Joined: 12/07/06
Posts: 1591

I say merry christmas. My cards will say happy holidays since with my luck they will show up after Christmas, there are people I send them to who don't celebrate Christmas, and I am including New Years in this.

We have a Christmas party at work. Zayden's school does a Holiday party and tries SO hard to not mention or address Christmas it drives me nuts.

I think we can recognize that it is Christmas, a holiday celebrated by millions, without even addressing the religous aspects. We try to hard to be politically correct we get annoying.

Jenn0113's picture
Joined: 03/09/07
Posts: 5335

Um...what? LOL

My cards say Merry Christmas and usually have a scripture on them. I don't celebrate "holidays" I celebrate Christmas and what it means to me and my faith. I go to Christmas parties and Holiday parties but I'd have a Christmas party.

However, that being said - I don't care what other people call it or why they celebrate it. If you don't celebrate Christmas the way I do that's fine by me, I'm not offended. I do get offended when people ACT offended when I say Merry Christmas. It should be up to each person to decide what to say based on their beliefs. Like if someone wished me a Happy Hanukkah I wouldn't be offended at all that they wished me a happy 8 days of Jewish celebrating. In turn, I would never want Jewish people to have to STOP calling it Hanukkah or feel the need to down play their beliefs to conform to mine.

Joined: 01/12/09
Posts: 658

Okay for me I HATE it.

I mean I'm all for taking others feelings into account but its CHRISTMAS its not Seasons greetings.

I can see people not wanting the religious aspect of Christmas being shoved down their throats but come one, I'm saying merry christmas. I'm spreeding joy and cheer.

If someone says to me happy Quanzaa or Diwali or Hanukkah I say thank you and say it back. I hate that some companys dont' use the word Christmas even TV shows. The kids were watching Jack and the Neverland Pirates the other day and they had what was CLEARLY a Christmas tree but called it the Winter Treasure day tree WTF?

So in answer to my own questions

My cards say Merry Christmas
I will be having and going to a Christmas party
and YES I think its FAR to politically correct

Joined: 01/12/09
Posts: 658

"Jenn0113" wrote:

Um...what? LOL.

Well Jenn here I find most jobs and schools AVOID the word christmas and just say Holiday tree or seasons greetings. Some governments even use those words .. like there is a 50 foot "holiday tree" at city hall. Blum 3

Joined: 01/12/09
Posts: 658

Oh and if the malls want to put up trees and Menorahs thats great. Then I can point them out to my kids and explain about Hanukkah

Jenn0113's picture
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"mama22Girls" wrote:

Well Jenn here I find most jobs and schools AVOID the word christmas and just say Holiday tree or seasons greetings. Some governments even use those words .. like there is a 50 foot "holiday tree" at city hall. Blum 3

Oh yeah, I see that a lot. Its a tree...with decorations...but its not a Christmas tree Wink

The other day Jus and I were watching a TV show with Deacon and we sat there just amazed at how this cartoon went out of their way to avoid the word Christmas - like its a bad word. Holiday Caroling, Holiday Tree, Holiday Cookies with santa on them, etc. Its so annoying.

Justin's company party got changed to a Holiday party in the last few years and it bugs me. Mainly because I live in a pretty conservative, pretty religious area IMO. The fact that they changed it from Christmas Party to Holiday party just to keep from offending people bugs me. Why is it offensive - its a word?! religious or not, still a word. Like I was saying a few weeks ago here, I'd venture to guess that MOST people don't view Christmas as a religious holiday anymore anyway, so why be offended by it? What do trees, Santa, gifts, decorations, caroling, etc have to do with religion anyway? If it was TRULY a religious holiday I would assume that Christians would join together and protest the pagan rituals we all do and just focus entirely on Jesus' birth. Right?

Like I don't celebrate Halloween...but I would never tell people NOT to call it Halloween. It annoys me that the daycare Deacon goes too calls it a Harvest Festival...WTH - its a Halloween Carnival...its ON Halloween. LOL - Just bugs me. I think people are way too easily offended these days.

Jenn0113's picture
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"mama22Girls" wrote:

Oh and if the malls want to put up trees and Menorahs thats great. Then I can point them out to my kids and explain about Hanukkah

I agree. I love seeing Hanukkah stuff out at this time of year.

betsy0040's picture
Joined: 03/28/08
Posts: 121

I have a love/hate relationship with Christmas. Certain aspects I like and others not so much. But since I am Jewish any celebrating of Christmas is well not right, I guess. I don't have issues with Merry Christmas. I only have issue if you know my faith yet walk up to me and say Merry Christmas. If your cards say it that's fine, whatever, I don't expect you to change it for the one person on your list who isn't Christian. Then again I'm not doing cards and only get a few and if they say Merry Christmas I'm not going to make a big deal of it. It can be rather complicated but I've learned to deal with it and not make a big deal out of it. I've chosen not to celebrate it in my home even though my DH does "celebrate", he's not very religious so he doesn't really care one way or the other. I have learned the religious aspects of most it though so I don't feel right having a tree or singing most of the carols even though sometimes I can't help but sing along. When I was a kid and just realizing what it meant to be Jewish and in the choir at school I refused to sing a few of the carols that were religious.

serwachic's picture
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"Jenn0113" wrote:

My cards say Merry Christmas and usually have a scripture on them. I don't celebrate "holidays" I celebrate Christmas and what it means to me and my faith. I go to Christmas parties and Holiday parties but I'd have a Christmas party.

However, that being said - I don't care what other people call it or why they celebrate it. If you don't celebrate Christmas the way I do that's fine by me, I'm not offended. I do get offended when people ACT offended when I say Merry Christmas. It should be up to each person to decide what to say based on their beliefs. Like if someone wished me a Happy Hanukkah I wouldn't be offended at all that they wished me a happy 8 days of Jewish celebrating. In turn, I would never want Jewish people to have to STOP calling it Hanukkah or feel the need to down play their beliefs to conform to mine.

That pretty much sums up how I feel about it, too. The phrase "Happy Holidays" doesn't offend me in the least. I even use it myself sometimes to refer to Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's. Oh yeah, and my birthday. Wink I do get a little bothered if someone is offended at me telling them Merry Christmas. It's not like I'm shouting, "Do you know the Lord? You're going to hell unless you say Merry Christmas back to me!!" I'm just wishing them well and telling them I hope they enjoy the holiday. If someone wishes me a Happy Hanukkah, I'm not offended and don't think it's a conspiracy to get me to be Jewish. And I respond, "Happy Hanukkah to you!" with a genuine wish that they enjoy the holiday.

I agree with Jenn, I think people are just so easily offended and there are so many BIGGER things to be bothered about - religious or otherwise - than what terms we use to say nice things to people.

3inpink's picture
Joined: 01/11/07
Posts: 451

Jenn & Kim I'm with you. I cannot stand the whole Happy Holidays thing. Kailee's teacher took a poll in class to see who celebrated what and it turned out all the children celebrated Christmas so it is used in her classroom, but throughout the school it is Happy Holidays. It drives me crazy.

The principal made an announcement the day before Thanksgiving - wishing everyone a Happy Holiday. THAT drove me NUTS. Since when is it not politically correct to say Happy Thanksgiving? It's a non-religious holiday.

Anyway I'm off topic, the girls lean towards saying Happy Holidays because that is what they are being taught in school. It's not the case. When I worked I had two sets of cards to respect my very religious Jewish work family and it was something that was my choice because I wanted to do it that way since I loved and respected them. They never ever expected it and actually usually bought me something very Christmas related every year which just showed our mutual respect for one another.

I think that it has become very Political and I don't like that at all. I have respect for everyone and for each to have their own celebrations and traditions! I wouldn't be insulted if someone wished me a Happy Hannuka (sp?) by any means. Needless to say I think it's because no one knows what Holiday a certain "stranger" celebrates so it became political.

Okay off my non-sense soap box of rambling and not making much sense. LOL.

betsy0040's picture
Joined: 03/28/08
Posts: 121

Jen, you're right, there are bigger things to be bothered by than this. But if you've never been non-Christian during Christmas then you can't really get it. Like I said I do not make a big deal of it, if someone sends me a card that says Merry Christmas. But you're not going to get Jewish people sending non-Jews Hanukkah cards, it just doesn't happen. So you probably won't be wished Happy Hanukkah unless you go to Hanukkah party like at a Synagogue or Temple. I don't care what you wish me and I'll say thank you and same to you back. But honestly Jewish people are not going to try to convert you, it's actually quite a process to convert. So it's really a different thing all together. I have learned that living in the south I just have to deal with it and ignore it. If I made a big deal out of it every time I would waste a lot of time and energy on it. My mom who has lived most of her life in the north has a harder time dealing with it.

abbyblack's picture
Joined: 06/18/09
Posts: 146

I for one am offended that it is only Christmas that is the target of all the PC BS. I do find it ridiculous that the church near me can't put up a nativity scene on it's private property. I do find it offensive that all the songs at public schools can't refer to Christmas during the Christmas Concert. I do find it offensive that Atheists who are making these demands of those of us who do celebrate Christmas get time off work during Christmas and Hanukkah. If they don't like my religion or that of Jews, that they don't need to take the time off during our holidays.

On another note, do the same government officials who refuse to call a Christmas Tree a Christmas tree call a Menorah a "Holiday Candle Holder"?? I think NOT! I am offended by the double standard.

I say Merry Christmas to those who say Happy Holidays because I don't celebrate "holidays". Christmas is the only holiday I celebrate. I hate that those who are religious have to hide it like it is taboo or something...

Merry Christmas! Smile

Joined: 01/12/09
Posts: 658

Abby I agree.. if you so against Christmas then don't take the day off. If you celebrate another religious event then you should get that day off instead.

I also agree that No religion should be pushed on anyone but don't feel that wishing someone merry Christmas or happy Hanukkah is pushing a religion, its just wishing someone happiness. I don't think wishing someone well is an attempt to convert, especially with Merry Christmas because a lot of people who celebrate it really don't do it for the religious aspects.

I'd love to see more out there about other religions and their celebrations. It just seems that Merry Christmas has turned into a dirty word.

Joined: 12/06/11
Posts: 45

It's not a big issue here unless you go to a big merchandise or resteraunt chain. Then it's happy holidays with decor but they still sell things with Merry Christmas and most of the employees still say Merry Christmas. I would never compromise my beliefs to make other people happy so I would expect nothing less from anyone else. I send out Christmas cards and would never send out anything else...if you don't like it tell me and I'll take you off my list.

Jenn0113's picture
Joined: 03/09/07
Posts: 5335

"CAMZphoto" wrote:

It's not a big issue here unless you go to a big merchandise or resteraunt chain. Then it's happy holidays with decor but they still sell things with Merry Christmas and most of the employees still say Merry Christmas. I would never compromise my beliefs to make other people happy so I would expect nothing less from anyone else. I send out Christmas cards and would never send out anything else...if you don't like it tell me and I'll take you off my list.

Ha - true. I send out my Christmas cards with scriptures to everyone on my list and so far no one has asked me to stop. I just assume people get it, read it, and if they don't agree with it they can toss it - but at least they know i cared enough about them to think of them and send them a card. (with the exception of this year since I didn't do a card, lol).

SID081108's picture
Joined: 06/03/09
Posts: 1348

"SoCaliLover" wrote:

I think we can recognize that it is Christmas, a holiday celebrated by millions, without even addressing the religous aspects. We try to hard to be politically correct we get annoying.

This

"Jenn0113" wrote:

However, that being said - I don't care what other people call it or why they celebrate it. If you don't celebrate Christmas the way I do that's fine by me, I'm not offended. I do get offended when people ACT offended when I say Merry Christmas. It should be up to each person to decide what to say based on their beliefs. Like if someone wished me a Happy Hanukkah I wouldn't be offended at all that they wished me a happy 8 days of Jewish celebrating. In turn, I would never want Jewish people to have to STOP calling it Hanukkah or feel the need to down play their beliefs to conform to mine.

And This!

I could have quoted most of you....since most of you said exactly what I wanted to say Wink

And to think that someone saying Merry Christmas to you is them trying to convert you or push their faith on you is just silly. Half the people who say it are not even religious, they just enjoy celebrating the day. Get over it, people!

And there is totally a double-standard, I agree with that too.

SID081108's picture
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Oh and I will never order a CHRISTMAS card that says "Happy Holidays" or "Season's Greetings" I just can't do it. Even if they don't get there by Christmas, it's still my Christmas Card and to send out anything else feels to me like buying into the PC crap.

keops's picture
Joined: 04/01/08
Posts: 813

OK I am an ATHEIST so my cards HAPPY HOLIDAYS ROFL (no offense to all of you with religion..)

I don't pay any attention to the way people call the holidays/season tome it is no big deal it is the same than Thanksgiving, 4th July etc except I get present for Florian....

we don't have PARTY for nothing just us 3 and no special food etc....

I decorate the house and made a tree for Florian no religious items nowhere to be found (SORRY)...

and NO OFFENSE (please be tolerant) one day Florian saw the Nativity scene in a store and he says "mama a farm" and I said yes it is a Farm.. I'll explain later to him he is only 3 !!!!

(I sure hope to not get an nobody S** list after this post) ROFL

Jenn0113's picture
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"keops" wrote:

OK I am an ATHEIST so my cards HAPPY HOLIDAYS ROFL (no offense to all of you with religion..)

I don't pay any attention to the way people call the holidays/season tome it is no big deal it is the same than Thanksgiving, 4th July etc except I get present for Florian....

we don't have PARTY for nothing just us 3 and no special food etc....

I decorate the house and made a tree for Florian no religious items nowhere to be found (SORRY)...

and NO OFFENSE (please be tolerant) one day Florian saw the Nativity scene in a store and he says "mama a farm" and I said yes it is a Farm.. I'll explain later to him he is only 3 !!!!

(I sure hope to not get an nobody S** list after this post) ROFL

I like that I can send you my Christmas card every year and you won't be offended Magali. Smile I'm never offended by your holiday card. I've never felt like you have tried to get me to NOT believe by sending me one - IYKWIM. We celebrate the day for different reasons...I can't make you (not you directly, just everyone in general) celebrate Jesus on Christmas and you (again, general) can't make me NOT celebrate Him.

As far as the farm goes...I mean really, it was a farm/stable - so he is right and so are you. Smile I tell Deacon that Mary had to have her baby in the barn because no one had room for them. This morning we passed a field of donkeys and I asked him if he thought that was the same donkey that Mary rode on when she had her baby. LOL They just don't really get it at this age.

SID081108's picture
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You're on my S*** LIST, Magali!!!!!!

ROFL JUST KIDDING Wink

Your post made me laugh

mommaphoebs's picture
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Wow! I have to say, I don't understand why people get offended about this. There are so many religious beliefs in this world, why would someone get offended? As I've mentioned before on here, I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses, and don't celebrate Christmas because of the origins. Many people assume we're not Christians or don't believe in Jesus, which couldn't be further from the truth. Christmas has nothing to do with Christ. If the churches have chosen to adopt it as such, that's up to them. I'm not offended by people choosing to celebrate, that's up to them! I will say this though, it's incredible how much of the elementary school curriculum surrounds holidays! Ireland's school has been fabulous in adapting for her, and for other JW students in the school. The kids that celebrate, do their holiday stuff, the one's that don't, including the Muslim students, have a non-holiday option. This year they are doing a Winter concert, not a Christmas concert, so that ALL the students can participate and have the experience! I think that is a kindness to ALL the students, not excluding those who don't celebrate. Last year, they had a Christmas concert, and Ireland didn't participate, fine! I appreciate that they are trying to accommodate everyone. If sometimes she can't participate, it's not the end of the world! But for someone to be offended because it's not a Christmas concert every year, I find to be close-minded. Thankfully, Ireland's school recognizes there are many beliefs out there!
As for people wishing me a Merry Christmas or whatever they choose to say, I just smile and say thank-you! They're only being kind! If they ask me about what I'm doing for Christmas, or if I'm done my shopping etc, I just nicely tell them I don't celebrate. I've yet to have anyone be offended! If they ask me why, I tell them.
Honestly, I don't see why anyone needs to be offended. In most cases, people just have good intentions.

Jenn0113's picture
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I just wanted to add that I love reading the various opinions by everyone with different beliefs. So interesting.

Joined: 01/12/09
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"keops" wrote:

(I sure hope to not get an nobody S** list after this post) ROFL

no offence taken. Smile

keops's picture
Joined: 04/01/08
Posts: 813

OK the new version of the site is driving me crazy now everything is RED :eek:

Carrie I don't want to offend you I just don't get it and DON'T CARE but don't "B**" about it.. I was raised in a Christian country so at school we had Easter break, X-Mas etc..... but I was never raised in any religions....
so for me it is THE HOLIDAYS and I respect all the beliefs or NON BELIEF.... and when people tell me Merry Christmas I reply Merry Christmas, when they say Happy Hanukkah I reply "happy Hanukkah" etc.... JUST DON'T FORCE IT ON ME..... ROFL

You (nobody in particular) your IDEAS and I have MINE and we can all live together on the same earth and as MOTHER we love our kid(s) with no end wether we are Christian, Jew, Jehovah's, Muslim, Buddhist or Atheist !!! Wink

Joined: 01/12/09
Posts: 658

I agree Jenn, its nice to hear all different opinions.

Pheobs I agree I have no issues with school holiday concerts when there is more then one religion involoved but I hate how they can't even say the word in some schools and how city hall trees are festive or holiday trees.

This sums it up LOL

mommaphoebs's picture
Joined: 07/16/06
Posts: 159

Kim, your comic reminded me of this one someone sent me:
(Have no clue if this will show up....) I'm assuming it's not an actual Charlie Brown comic.

SID081108's picture
Joined: 06/03/09
Posts: 1348

Hmmm I can't see it.

Lavender444's picture
Joined: 03/27/03
Posts: 1944

I am a super simple girl when it comes to my card purchases. I buy whatever is cuter. Blum 3 This year my cards say Happy holidays, But honetly I had no idea they said that until I looked closely thanks to this post. lol!

asteuck's picture
Joined: 10/30/07
Posts: 355

I could have quoted several of you guys too.
I don't see what the big deal is either. I say Merry Christmas. But I don't/wouldn't get offended if someone told me Happy Holidays/Happy Hanukkah..etc. If that is your belief then tell me that but don't get offended by mine.
And like someone else said I do sometimes say Happy Holidays referring to Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years.
And like Amber I just buy the card that is cutest! Smile This year it says Merry Christmas, I think last year was Happy Holidays.

Joined: 06/03/07
Posts: 623

I've been wondering how to answer this, without sounding harsh or whiney.

I'm not anywhere on the judeo-christian spectrum. I've grown up here, surrounded by it. All I can say is that, as an outsider to Christianity, I'm baffled that people think there is a "war on Christmas" or that you are being forced to "hide Christmas" or whatever. I see nothing covert about it around me. My advertising flyers, TV ads, everything is literally telling me the countdown to Christmas, in those words. I can't speak to what individual public school districts enforce, I'm not there yet. Maybe you need to spend December in a country that's not predominantly Christian to see what it's like where Christmas isn't blasted at you, 24/7, for over a month.

That said, I am in no way offended by anyone wishing me a Merry Christmas, or references to Christmas. I am touched and thankful anytime someone goes out of their way to wish me well. It's Christmas-time!! Of course people are going to be talking about it and if that's your faith, of course it's wonderful. To be offended by that is also bizarre to me.

My holiday cards will always be Happy Holidays or of that type. I hope my recipients are not going to be offended by that. This time of year is full of holidays of different sorts, and HH is the most inclusive.

Growing up here, as a non-Christian (and non-white in an area that was very Caucasian), was mostly awesome. I don't remember any problems. But, I most certainly felt like an outsider during Christmas season. As a pre-teen, teen ... I didn't need any additional reasons to feel different, lol.

For me, when stores, restaurants, etc. - which are providing a service to, I hope, ALL their customers - say HH, I feel *more* included than when they say MC. And, to reiterate, I don't mind it when they wish me a MC.

Abby, your post made me sad. It actually made me tear up (probably my preggo hormones more than anything). Clearly you love your faith and it was a heartfelt post. But, for me, it took me back to some darker memories of being excluded and shunned for not being the norm. When I read all the things that you are offended about, it makes me feel like you are stomping all over me for not believing what you do, and that you feel I have no rights whatsoever for feeling like that. (OTOH, I don't understand why a church cannot put up a nativity scene on their own private property? I've seen those around, so maybe your area has some different laws? I understand why someone would be upset about that).

No one is stopping anyone from celebrating their own way. But, in a public setting, why is it so distasteful to do/say something that is more inclusive, rather than not? I don't get it.

Jenn0113's picture
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FWIW Shelly - I didn't think you sounded harsh or whiny. I love that you came on to be as honest as you were.

Joined: 06/03/07
Posts: 623

Thanks Jenn.

I forgot to answer all of Kim's OP questions:

What is your opinion on "Politicly correct Christmas'?" I don't like the term "PC", because it seems to have a bad rap. I'm pro broader inclusivity during this time of year. BUT, if it's specifically about Christmas-only things - please don't airbrush. Say Christmas.

Do your cards say "merry christmas or happy holidays?" HH, or Happy New Year, or Season's Greetings.

Do you have a christmas party or holiday party. If I had a party, it'd just be "get together at my place" or "NY's Eve party" if apropos. I go to whatever party I'm invited to, if I want to attend. I've never actually been invited to a Christmas party, though, don't think.

Do you think its too political or not political enough, or maybe just right? Just right, I guess. Not sure.

keops's picture
Joined: 04/01/08
Posts: 813

Shelly I love your answer !! and I feel the "same "in some of your comments..... Wink funny for me "also" as a non Christian all the stores, radio etc are doing X-Mas whatever you are "on it or not" and It is fine by me I could careless since it doesn't mean ANYTHING to me...

HAPPY CHRISTMAS, HANUKKAH, HOLIDAYS, NEW YEAR...WHATEVER YOU WANT...TO EVERYBODY be safe, drive safe love your babies , family and friends (and pets)

abbyblack's picture
Joined: 06/18/09
Posts: 146

Shelly, I'm not a church "goer" or belong to a certain faith like you automatically assumed. I am just a woman who supports Christians and their right to celebrate Christmas. My Jewish and Muslim friends find it absurd what has happened in the last 10 years since we were in high school.

You feel sad?? I feel sad for the people who do celebrate Christmas because they have been asked by the minority to discard their "Christmas Trees", "Christmas Cards", red and green, Saint Nickolaus, Three Wise Men, the Nativity scene, and Christ himself in favor of generic colors, "Happy Holidays", reindeer, snowflakes, and generic decorations. There was a time when students could sing "It's beginning to look a lot like Christmas", "Silent Night", "I have a little draidel", "Silent Night", "Away in the Manger" etc, but today those songs have had to be reduced to "Frosty the Snowman", "Jingle Bells", "Let it Snow" and "Marshmallow world"...I support the poor churches that can't put up Christmas decorations because atheists think the decoration is forcing some type of belief on them. I feel bad for the Christian student who can't say Christmas, wear red/green, or put Merry Christmas on the card to their teacher for fear of "offending" someone.

This article put it best:

"Once upon a time not all that long ago – in fact, anyone over 50 will easily remember it – the word “Christmas” was everywhere during the month of December. Everywhere you looked – in stores, in town squares, in cities, in offices, and, of course, in private homes — there were Christmas trees, Christmas decorations, Christmas cards, Christmas gifts, Christmas parties, Christmas Breasks, Christmas Concerts, and Christmas vacations.

Christmas was arguably the most beloved of American holidays. Independence Day, Memorial Day, and Thanksgiving were important too; but Christmas was something more. It gave rise to a whole “Christmas season” during which people got into the “Christmas spirit.” The first words of a popular song, recorded by Johnny Mathis as a platinum hit, summed it up perfectly: “It’s beginning to look a lot like Christmas / Everywhere you go…”

Then something strange began to happen. The very thing that made the “season” special started to disappear from the public arena. Stores no longer held “Christmas sales.” Businesses, and soon after, individuals, ceased to hold “Christmas parties.” And on and on. “Christmas” became a dirty word, and was replaced by “holiday.”

keops's picture
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deleted by ME Wink

3inpink's picture
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We were leaving girl scouts last night after the Christmas Party, and one of the other leaders corrected Emma on the way out when she said Merry Christmas, and she told her in front of me that the proper response was Happy Holidays, and I very politely said in front of the other leader (who mind you handed Emma a bag of goodies in a Christmas designed paper), that for her it was fine and just as nice to say Merry Christmas, that is what we celebrate and although some people do not celebrate Christmas and a "safe" response is Happy Holidays I did not feel it was necessary for her to be corrected.

Needless to say I have respect for all of us and for everyone who celebrates any holiday and therefore understand the Happy Holiday and did further explain to Emma how it was meant and said that I did not agree with her to be corrected by another adult.

Okay, rambling again, I get it but don't feel it was necessary for my daughter to be corrected for wishing someone a Merry Christmas at a Christmas party. Make sense?

I also do believe that Christ has a lot to do with Christmas, not necessarily in the way it is portrayed in the stores and for shopping and all that but as a Catholic Christian the CHRISTMAS is pretty clear. There is a place in a shopping center near my house that I need to get a picture of. There is a Christmas Tree, A HUGE Menorah and then a HUGE Nativity that says lets keep CHRIST in CHRISTMAS. I love that it's all in the same place right next to each other.

stillsurprised's picture
Joined: 04/21/08
Posts: 68

I probably fall in the same category as Magali and Shelly on this one, so I thought you all might enjoy this story.
Sam found a book that a friend of ours gave her last year. Its a cute little board book about the meaning of Christmas. It kinda goes on about how it's not about gifts but about a celebration of love and family...AND Jesus' birthday. Never wanting to keep information away from my kids, I feel it's always best to be honest and shoot from the hip--
Sam said "Mom who's Jesus?"
I said "Jesus was this really awesome guy, who lived a long time ago and taught everybody to be kind and love one another."
Sam said "Oh."
Later my husband, who grew up a strict Catholic, asked what that was all about.
"Way to downplay JESUS, Tam." He laughed.
I said "What??? Was I lying??"

I'm never offended by anything Christmas. Regardless of what the holiday has come to mean for me and my family, I know the reason the holiday even exists is the birth of Jesus. This country was founded by Christians escaping religious persecution. Christianity is therefore a cultural norm for me. Now the Kardashians.... they offend me... Smile

mommaphoebs's picture
Joined: 07/16/06
Posts: 159

Since it was brought up, I feel I have to comment on it. Personally, nothing bugs me more about Christmas, than the signs that say, "Keep Christ in Christmas." The Bible does not provide us with the date of Jesus' birth. Christmas (Dec. 25) is not Jesus' birthday. You can find that in any encyclopedia. He was likely born in fall time, since the Bible tells us the shepherds were out in the fields at night with their sheep, during the winter they were kept under cover.
The Encyclopedia Americana says, "the reason for establishing December 25 as Christmas is somewhat obscure, but it is usually held that the day was chosen to correspond to pagan festivals that took place around the time of the winter solstice, when the days begin to lengthen, to celebrate the 'rebirth of the sun'...The Roman Saturnalia (a festival dedicated to Saturn), also took place at this time, and some Christmas customs are thought to be rooted in this ancient pagan celebration."
The New Catholic Encyclopedia says, "The date of Christ's birth is not known. The Gospels indicate neither the day nor the month."

Abby, I'm a Christian and I choose to not celebrate Christmas. I don't prevent others from celebrating should they choose to, and am very respectful of their right to choose that, even though I don't agree. However, for those in the world who choose NOT to celebrate, look at our side. If you're all about 'rights' well we have rights too, don't we? I'm not stopping anyone from using whatever wording they choose, but on the other hand, remember not everyone celebrates. We're inundated with everything Christmas for at least a month each year. If not all children are celebrating Christmas, why have only a Christmas concert? My daughter attends public school with children of many religions, not Catholic school.
What I find "sad" is that the "Christmas spirit" that people like to talk about, is limited to one time of the year.
My opinion.

serwachic's picture
Joined: 01/01/10
Posts: 178

I just read this article, and it actually gave me a lot to think about:

Are Christians Fighting the Wrong War on Christmas? http://www.skyejethani.com/are-christians-fighting-the-wrong-war-on-christmas/1076/

It's been nagging at me lately that Christmas is likely a pagan holiday, but Christians get so upset that others don't recognize the "Christianity" behind it. The truth is that Christians kind of threw our own meaning and symbolism into Christmas. I mean, giving presents because that's what the wise men did? I've never understood how that's an excuse for spending tons of money on our children. Seems to me that Christians should be considering gifts that we can give to Christ to represent what the wise men did. Things we can sacrifice to Him.

I don't know...the more I'm researching Christmas' origins, I'm feeling like my family is doing it all wrong. I don't think there's anything wrong with a Christmas Tree, Santa Claus, with stockings, or gifts. I just wonder if I'm being foolish to try and say those things are a symbol of my Christianity.

I'm wondering if I should be teaching my boys that we do those things because they're fun, not because we're Christian. We focus on advent, we sacrifice money and time, we are kind, and we celebrate that Jesus humbled Himself to a human because we're Christian.

I know I'm rambling, I'm just thinking through a lot of this stuff and realizing how silly and secular so much of Christmas is. There's nothing wrong with being silly and secular, I'm just thinking I might stop wrapping it up in a "Christian" bow and start calling it was it is. Fun and Christmas-ey...but not a symbolism of my faith.

SoCaliLover's picture
Joined: 12/07/06
Posts: 1591

The interesting part for us is we typically celebrate Christmas with both religious and non religious themes!

I am Catholic (convert though) and raised DD and will raise Z in church --it is very important to me.

DH is either agnostic or atheist --depends on when you ask him and DSD were NEVER raised in church. They have no beliefs that are religious. That makes me sad sometimes but I respect it. (remember they were teens when they moved in with us so I did not convert them)

My dad is very strictly atheist but both DH and I are from very strong German Lutheran backgrounds so in our family there is a lot of religion.

Make sense?

So I celebrate Christmas and we have some very strong traditions for Christmas even though they are not religious themes. The girls always have celebrated Christmas with their parents, even with no religion.

We traditionally go to Christmas eve mass and sometimes Christmas day mass but usually its only me, Tiff, and now Z and DH (DH will go to church with me to help with Z)

Its funny that our girls are so excited about Christmas even though they have no religious meaning to them.

With Z I will celebrate advent, we will read the Christmas story, we will bake a cake for Jesus birthday but we will have the Christmas Tree, and Santa, and elves, and reindeer and all the other parts of the non religious holiday.

Seems to me that Christmas has turned almost into two holidays --one religious one not, and we celebrate both parts.

Totally as an aside, when Z gets older we will work on recognizing other holidays including Hanukkah etc. so he learns tolerance and understanding.

Jenn0113's picture
Joined: 03/09/07
Posts: 5335

Jen - Justin and I have been discussing the same issues for years. Christmas wasn't originally a Christian holiday, Christians just piggybacked on it and called it Christian. However, like you said, we will still celebrate it - like we do other holidays. But we also are teaching Deacon about Jesus and his birth and the whole story of Mary, Joseph, a virgin birth, etc - when its age appropriate.

But at the same time, knowing it wasn't a Christian holiday originally I have a hard time understanding when people are offended by Merry Christmas - since it has nothing to do with religion really.

We do get a laugh out of the "Keep Christ in Christmas" car magnets though....since really it was MAN that put Christ in Christmas to begin with, lol. Those do kind of annoy me.I just roll my eyes and keep going. I don't think its BAD that Christians celebrate Christ at this time of year - why is it ever bad to celebrate what you believe?

mommaphoebs's picture
Joined: 07/16/06
Posts: 159

So funny--tonight was Ireland's concert, and when they introduced it and said, "welcome to our winter concert," the lady behind me whispers to her friend, "notice they said WINTER concert and not CHRISTMAS concert." I felt like saying, "yes that's so ALL the children of ALL faiths, can participate, including my daughter." Smile
Can't say I understand why people are bothered by that. It IS winter after all!

SID081108's picture
Joined: 06/03/09
Posts: 1348

"Jenn0113" wrote:

I don't think its BAD that Christians celebrate Christ at this time of year - why is it ever bad to celebrate what you believe?

EXACTLY. It doesn't really matter to me what the origins are. What matters to me is that it's the time of year that I CHOOSE to celebrate Christ's birth. I'm not an idiot...I know that Jesus Christ wasn't actually born on December 25th and so does the average person that has spent any time in church. I don't know why the church picked that day to celebrate it and quite frankly I don't care. All I care about is that I do and will celebrate it that day and teach my children about the birth of Christ and focus on it at that time of year. I will also allow them to have the fun of Christmas in Santa, etc, to an extent. I agree with Amy in that you can incorporate both into your traditions. And I agree with Jenn that it makes it that much more silly that people get offended by "Merry Christmas", if it's not *technically* even a religious holiday anyway.

I can totally see Shelly's side because it's a different point of view coming from a different culture. Being married to someone who grew up in a different country, I guess I am more sensitive to how differently he sees the world sometimes because of that. For some of us, we see how much has changed in the past few years regarding what we might view as the "limiting of our religious freedoms", but for Shelly (correct me if I'm wrong), she might see that we still have a million times more freedom to say and show what we believe then most other countries do, evidenced in part by how much Christmas she is still bombarded with every year. I think it's just a different perspective.

mommaphoebs's picture
Joined: 07/16/06
Posts: 159

"SID081108" wrote:

EXACTLY. It doesn't really matter to me what the origins are. What matters to me is that it's the time of year that I CHOOSE to celebrate Christ's birth. I'm not an idiot...I know that Jesus Christ wasn't actually born on December 25th and so does the average person that has spent any time in church. I don't know why the church picked that day to celebrate it and quite frankly I don't care. All I care about is that I do and will celebrate it that day and teach my children about the birth of Christ and focus on it at that time of year. I will also allow them to have the fun of Christmas in Santa, etc, to an extent. I agree with Amy in that you can incorporate both into your traditions. And I agree with Jenn that it makes it that much more silly that people get offended by "Merry Christmas", if it's not *technically* even a religious holiday anyway.

I respectfully disagree.
The Bible tells us to worship with spirit and truth. There is no truth in Christmas or in telling children some guy named Santa is bringing them gifts, then telling them when they're older, well actually, we haven't been completely honest with you; doesn't really build trust, nor is it in any way, worshipping in truth. To pick a pagan festival date to worship Jesus' birth, makes no sense to me. Jesus' own disciples didn't even celebrate his birth! What was important was what his death made possible for people, forgiveness from sin. It was Jesus' death he asked his disciples to commemorate, not his birth. That's what our family remembers each year, on the date that coincides with Nisan 14, a date we are given in the Bible, so as to commemorate on the appropriate day. There is nothing wrong with having lovely family gatherings, giving gifts to one another. It's not necessary to do so on one specific date, just because a date on the calendar says to.